slow fire technique

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slow fire technique

Post by 285wannab on 7/14/2018, 7:08 pm

I have a question for the masters and high masters.  How do you shoot slow fire?  Do you come from above and when you drop into the spot that will produce a ten do you pull the trigger or are you on that spot for say  1 second,  2 seconds or longer.
Myself,  I spend 3 second on the spot and any longer I abort the shoot.

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Re: slow fire technique

Post by Tim:H11 on 7/14/2018, 8:11 pm

Having already acquired stance, position, and grip: straighten arm with gun pointed down toward bench and raise gun. Movement is at the shoulder. I come up and go beyond my target. As I’m raising the gun I’m focusing on keeping the dot centered in the tube. At the peak of my arm raise I allow the arm to lower bringing the dot within the line of sight I have with the target. As I’m lowering I’m slowing my self down. I’m also beginning my trigger press. My press at this point is more like stacking tension. When the dot comes down on to the target and centers up my finger shouldn’t have much further to go. I hold longer than many say that I should but it works for me. As I’m holding I’m waiting for my wobble to slow to that one short moment where there isn’t hardly much movement. I have to commit to my trigger press at this point and push straight through. The shot breaks and it’s in the black.
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Re: slow fire technique

Post by john bickar on 7/14/2018, 8:44 pm

If I was starting over today, I would not come down into the target from above. I would raise into the target from the bench, and only put my finger inside the trigger guard once the muzzle was pointing at the backstop.

Those are things that are easy enough to learn if you are just starting out; they’re challenging for me to “unlearn” after N0,000 repetitions.

As for time in your aiming area until breaking the shot, it’ll depend on your hold and your trigger control. Make your hold better, and it’ll seem like you have more time to squeeze the trigger smoothly; learn to squeeze the trigger smoothly and rapidly, and you can do that within a shorter timeframe of optimum wobble.
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Re: slow fire technique

Post by joy2shoot on 7/14/2018, 8:55 pm

john bickar wrote:.... I would raise into the target from the bench....
I find that my scores are higher when I do it this way.


john bickar wrote:....squeeze the trigger smoothly and rapidly.....
I find that when I dry fire against a blank wall, I do a decent job of squeezing smoothly.  It is rapidly squeezing smoothly that I need to get much better at.

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Re: slow fire technique

Post by james r chapman on 7/14/2018, 9:27 pm

[quote="joy2shoot"]
john bickar wrote:.... I would raise into the target from the bench....

I find I crossfire a lot less when I raise from the # up!
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Re: slow fire technique

Post by john bickar on 7/14/2018, 10:36 pm

james r chapman wrote:
john bickar wrote:.... I would raise into the target from the bench....

I find I crossfire a lot less when I raise from the # up!

“It’s easier to shoot consistently on my own target, as I have trained myself to do, when I raise from the number up.”

There, I flipped your negative statement to a positive for ya.
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Re: slow fire technique

Post by LenV on 7/14/2018, 10:57 pm

Our numbers are above the target. What to do, what to do... Laughing
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Re: slow fire technique

Post by 285wannab on 7/15/2018, 1:41 pm

The reason why I ask is I was talking to someone that use to be a good shooter and he told me he would come from 12:00 to the center and pull the trigger.  No waiting for the wobble to calm down.  It worked for him.
Sounds like no one else shoots like that.
He also told me for timed and rapid on recoil to say 10:30 he would bring the gun over to 12 then come down. 
Different style, one I have never heard about.
Trying to find those elusive five or so points.

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Re: slow fire technique

Post by joy2shoot on 7/15/2018, 9:39 pm

285wannab, I know you addressed your question to Masters and High Masters.  I have shot master level scores in outdoor, 3 gun sanctioned 2700s but never back to back, which is what is needed to be classified as a Master.  

I attended a clinic by a many times national champion who does not like to be quoted who would probably say you are suppose to start the trigger pull before everything is lined up. If you wait until everything is just right, you are too late.  In my opinion, whether you come down into the black or up into the black, trigger pull needs to start before you reach ideal conditions.

Regarding rapid fire, in my case, if I went from recoil position to 12-above-the-black and then down into the black, I would run out of time when shooting my .45.

My personal mindset is when I lock my eyes on the black, I want to shoot it.  I don't want the gun going past it and then back into it.  I don't want to raise the gun and then check on things and then begin the final steps.  I want to shoot it.  Therefore, I am trying to gear my shot process to how my mind wants to do things.

Over time, I have changed and fine tuned how I do things.  And I think that is ok.  I think of it as continuous process improvement.  If it is not working, change it.  Nothing is so scared that it is not subject to be changed to accommodate the shooter.

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Re: slow fire technique

Post by Chris Miceli on 7/16/2018, 12:18 pm

john bickar wrote:
james r chapman wrote:
john bickar wrote:.... I would raise into the target from the bench....

I find I crossfire a lot less when I raise from the # up!

“It’s easier to shoot consistently on my own target, as I have trained myself to do, when I raise from the number up.”

There, I flipped your negative statement to a positive for ya.
too much issf for you
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Re: slow fire technique

Post by Orpanaut on 7/16/2018, 8:29 pm

I watched Keith Sanderson shoot slow fire during the NTT at Perry yesterday and noticed that he has an unusual shot process.

His stance is almost perpendicular to the target. Once his grip is set with the pistol still lowered to the bench, he looks to his left, raises his arm to a 45 degree angle, then lowers it onto the target while still looking to his left. He doesn't turn his head to face downrange until the pistol is already settled and aligned with the target.

Another interesting thing I noticed is that he wasn't using a gun box and had his spotting scope on some sort of short stand that required him to completely break his stance to crouch down for a look.

It works for him.

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Re: slow fire technique

Post by joy2shoot on 7/16/2018, 8:45 pm

Orpanaut wrote:... raises his arm to a 45 degree angle ...

If I understand this (which I probably don't), does this mean if he were shooting at a range with a berm, such as Canton, that the gun would be pointing over the berm?

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Re: slow fire technique

Post by zanemoseley on 7/16/2018, 9:16 pm

A 45 degree raise while a bit high isn't probably all that uncommon. Some ranges have protection against errant shots, Columbia TN has wood paneling to protect the surrounding areas.

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Re: slow fire technique

Post by john bickar on 7/16/2018, 11:19 pm

Chris Miceli wrote:too much issf for you
That’s enough outta you.
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Re: slow fire technique

Post by james r chapman on 7/17/2018, 5:58 am

john bickar wrote:
Chris Miceli wrote:too much issf for you
That’s enough outta you.

LOL
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Re: slow fire technique

Post by Orpanaut on 7/17/2018, 12:02 pm

Yes, Sanderson's pistol would have been pointed way over the berm at most ranges. At Perry, a shot fired at the top of his arm lift would have landed somewhere in Lake Erie.

I just looked at the results. Sanderson shot a 91-2X slow in the NTT, which is very good, and 199-8X on the short line, which is amazing. I wish I could have watched his sustained fire technique as well.


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Re: slow fire technique

Post by Chris Miceli on 7/17/2018, 12:10 pm

Orpanaut wrote:Yes, Sanderson's pistol would have been pointed way over the berm at most ranges.  At Perry,  a shot fired at the top of his arm lift would have landed somewhere in Lake Erie.

I just looked at the results.  Sanderson shot a 91-2X slow in the NTT, which is very good, and 199-8X on the short line, which is amazing.  I wish I could have watched his sustained fire technique as well.

he waits for the target to fully face, then it seems like 3-4 seconds ( i didn't time him) later he starts his string of 5.
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Re: slow fire technique

Post by Orpanaut on 7/17/2018, 12:27 pm

Just one more note: Keith Sanderson won the Anheuser Busch trophy (for the civilian shooter with the highest combined score in the NTI and NTT) with a 576-19X.

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Re: slow fire technique

Post by robert84010 on 7/17/2018, 10:13 pm

Chris Miceli wrote:
Orpanaut wrote:Yes, Sanderson's pistol would have been pointed way over the berm at most ranges.  At Perry,  a shot fired at the top of his arm lift would have landed somewhere in Lake Erie.

I just looked at the results.  Sanderson shot a 91-2X slow in the NTT, which is very good, and 199-8X on the short line, which is amazing.  I wish I could have watched his sustained fire technique as well.

he waits for the target to fully face, then it seems like 3-4 seconds ( i didn't time him) later he starts his string of 5.
I'm betting because he is a Olympic record holder, many times World Cup gold medalist in Olympic rapid fire, 10 seconds seems a bit much for 5 rounds.

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Re: slow fire technique

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