The battle of the bulge...

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The battle of the bulge...

Post by Multiracer on 9/6/2018, 8:22 pm

So, revolvers, model 52's and some 357's shooting 38 special loads.
What tool is out there to make these cases straight walled again ?
Or.....is it of no consequence to see these cases bulged a bit near the base?
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by STEVE SAMELAK on 9/6/2018, 8:32 pm

When in doubt consult the all mighty chamber gage.
If it gages good it will probably be good .
I don't believe any of the sizing dies go all the way to the rim....but I'm frequently wrong.
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by Multiracer on 9/6/2018, 8:47 pm

I don't believe any of the sizing dies go all the way to the rim....but I'm frequently wrong.


Its along these lines that make me believe there must be a tool that will go to the rim ?

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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by Wobbley on 9/6/2018, 8:50 pm

Some of the steel dies made back in the 1960s will size down to within .090 of the rim.
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by Multiracer on 9/6/2018, 8:59 pm

I just did some research on a LEE Bulge Buster... no 38 special or 357 available......boo. I wonder if I could machine down a shell holder to a minimum and gain some more ?

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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by Multiracer on 9/6/2018, 9:01 pm

Wobbley wrote:Some of the steel dies made back in the 1960s will size down to within .090 of the rim.


Steel dies are terrible to work with, especially after using carbide.

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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by Wobbley on 9/6/2018, 9:14 pm

True, but you only have to do it once or twice in a case’s life.
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by STEVE SAMELAK on 9/6/2018, 9:49 pm

Multiracer wrote:I just did some research on a LEE Bulge Buster... no 38 special or 357 available......boo.  I wonder if I could machine down a shell holder to a minimum and gain some more ?

I think you'd have to go to a tool grinder to take some off the end of the die body & carbide ring plus face off the top of the shell holder.
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by 310yuma on 9/6/2018, 10:08 pm

Lee also makes a smallbase u-die in ,38, it will go down a remove most of the  bulge
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by willnewton on 9/7/2018, 9:11 am

Multiracer wrote:I just did some research on a LEE Bulge Buster... no 38 special or 357 available......boo.  I wonder if I could machine down a shell holder to a minimum and gain some more ?
That is because a bulge buster pushes the case completely through the die, which is not possible with a rimmed case.
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by Dr.Don on 9/7/2018, 9:14 am

The end of the sizer is rounded or countersunk to make it easier for the case to enter without being perfectly aligned.  That fact, plus the thickness of the shell holder, prevents sizing all the way to the rim.  If you were to make a square ended die it would be supremely frustrating to use due to the alignment issues.
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by JIMPGOV on 9/7/2018, 9:27 am

REDDING HAS SPECIAL DIES FOR YOUR PROBLEM. PPC SHOOTERS HAVE BEEN USING THESE FOR YEARS. JIM P

http://redding-reloading.com/online-catalog/124-dual-ring-carbide-dies

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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by Multiracer on 9/7/2018, 10:10 am

JIMPGOV wrote:REDDING HAS SPECIAL DIES FOR YOUR PROBLEM. PPC SHOOTERS HAVE BEEN USING THESE FOR YEARS. JIM P

http://redding-reloading.com/online-catalog/124-dual-ring-carbide-dies

Well...lookie there. Thank you Jim P. I am going to do some more homework and possibly try this baby out.
Thanks

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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by PhotoEscape on 9/7/2018, 10:51 am

I'll save you some of the most valuable commodity, Multiracer, - time!  Redding's dual ring carbide dies will not address your issue if you need to size case all way down to the rim.  The closest to the rim sizing dies on the market today are Lee's carbide ones.  The only way to improve on that would be to "shave" off top portion of shell holder, although still leaving enough so case can be extracted without ripping off whatever left there, - I managed to do just that.  The good news is that shell holder is probably least costly component in this equation, so you can experiment.  Alternatively, I can measure mine, and provide you with data (and pictures).  Also, lube your cases!!  Just watch your fingers, when you get to the grinder! Smile   
AP
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by Multiracer on 9/7/2018, 11:08 am

Good deal, I just ordered a couple more shell holders for just that purpose. I may grind through the case hardening then chuck it up and face it off evenly.
Thanks again.

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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by bruce martindale on 9/7/2018, 9:41 pm

Photo has it right on the shell holder instead of grinding the die as some, maybe not all, dies hold the carbide ring in place by rolling the end of the die. If you grind it off, the ring can come out. I would look at different dies, like the Lee. Star press dies are the best for that.

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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by KB2MBC on 9/8/2018, 6:36 am

If the round chambers, I wouldn't give it any more thought. I consider a bulge being an abnormality caused by a chamber issue or excessive pressure with the latter being more obvious.
The "bulge" you see is simply the point where the sizing die stops. Everyone that reloads rimmed case ammunition has the same experience. It likely will not provide a point of failure, they usually split lengthwise and that's rare unless your shooting +P or nickel plated.

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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by AllAces on 9/8/2018, 7:58 am

I use Lee Factory Crimp die for .45, .38 and .38 Super. The Model 52 seems to be the most sensitive to bulging. I sample all of my ammo with drop gauges. Rounds that do not pass the drop test are set aside for the Lee die. However, since I started using Star reloaders several years ago I now use the Lee dies very little.
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by Multiracer on 9/8/2018, 9:11 am

Thanks Gents, Mucho appreciated.

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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by Multiracer on 9/10/2018, 8:17 pm



https://i.servimg.com/u/f26/19/64/86/35/img_2013.jpg

So, I shaved as much as I could off the top of the shell holder as well as the bottom of the normal decapping/ sizing die. This now sizes to within .161" of the bottom of the case. The Redding stock die with the modified shell holder sizes to within .176" of the bottom.

The measured result is only a difference of .003-.004" on the lower non sized area of the case. I feel its a success in the battle of the bulge.

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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by james r chapman on 9/10/2018, 8:25 pm

much ado over nothing Amigo...
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by Multiracer on 9/10/2018, 8:34 pm

It keeps me thinking, and you busy replying.

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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by noylj on 9/11/2018, 6:22 pm

Original post: Who cares as long as it chambers? The original M52 barrels will chamber UNSIZED cases and that improves accuracy. These rounds will NOT chamber in a revolver.
As long as the sized case chambers, that is all the sizing needed.
The only way to size to the rim is to have a sizing die with NO bevel at the mouth and you pound the case all the way in and then out of the die. As long as there is a shell holder, there is an absolute limit to how far one can size.
Lee and Hornady dies size the furthest down of standard commercial sizing dies that I have tried.

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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by Multiracer on 9/11/2018, 6:54 pm

Original post: Mentions a few different guns. I cared enough to do some bench work for my own assortment of guns. It made my 38 decapping /sizing mousetrap a little better than yours.
I will keep it to myself next time.......wow, tough crowd !
No one likes to think about the future ? Only what has been preached for centuries.
I use a case gauge now for every round, I use a cylinder for the revolvers.
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

Post by STEVE SAMELAK on 9/11/2018, 7:16 pm

As long as it makes you happy and not getting stiff the joints...who cares.
I have found that the easiest way to keep from getting stiff in the joints is to stay out of the joints & have a tendency to treat my 52 brass like it's bench rifle brass (trimmed, primer pockets uniformed, etc.).  It may not help my score but gives me something else to do besides chores.
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Re: The battle of the bulge...

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