HBWC vs DBBWC

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HBWC vs DBBWC

Post by KB2MBC on Sun Dec 28, 2014 5:34 pm

I'm wondering if anyone out there has had success with a double bevel-base wadcutter in their 52? Personally I use hollow base but I've got a small supply of the other that I'm thinking on using for indoor matches. Anyone with experience on this subject?

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Re: HBWC vs DBBWC

Post by Rob Kovach on Sun Dec 28, 2014 6:50 pm

If I was in your shoes I would use the DBWCs for indoor and the HBWCs for the long line.  DBWCs are plenty good for short line and indoors, but you need all the help you can get for the long line.

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Re: HBWC vs DBBWC

Post by sharkdoctor on Sun Dec 28, 2014 7:42 pm

Hi KB2,

I was playing with my sw52 just yesterday, shooting some cast Lee DEWC's - they are nearly symmetrical, but do have a small tit on the front end. They were sized 0.357", I was using 2.8 B'eye, in mixed cases (see Jerry Keefer's recc's for loading 38 SPL - he has forgotten more than most of us will ever know!).

Anyway at 50yd. off of a support, iron sights, they held 10 ring (n=10) and at 25yd., they held X-ring, albeit 2 groups (3 in one hole low, and 7 in one hole, high) but all in 1.5", so yes, some DEWC's will work.

That being said, when I shoot the 52 seriously, on the long line, I use HBWC's at 710 fps in R-P cases, loaded with WST (see Keefer).

Good shooting,
SD

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Re: HBWC vs DBBWC

Post by noylj on Sat Jan 03, 2015 2:49 am

If you want to shoot 3-8" groups, go for the DEWC. If you want accuracy, go for the Remington 148gn L-HBWCs only.

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Re: HBWC vs DBBWC

Post by Jerry Keefer on Sat Jan 03, 2015 10:25 am

noylj wrote:If you want to shoot 3-8" groups, go for the DEWC. If you want accuracy, go for the Remington 148gn L-HBWCs only.

Well, for standard .357 barrels, that is mostly true.. but the 52 is .355    Remington HBWCs are .361/.362 mid point..That is way to much squeeze in my opinion. Too much projectile distortion, and also increases pressures/recoil.
I have been working feverishly on a 52.. About a 1000 rounds of factory ammo thru it at this point with the .355 barrel.. This gun does not like the Remington Match 148 HBWC, at least this particular Lot#.. Now, I have several old cases of AMI from my PPC days, which is 148 HBWC sized to .357 and my lady shooter is putting together low to mid 90s longline and frequently cleaning 25 yards with it. So I am confident things are coming together.. The new fast twist barrel is in the lathe, but I am waiting on a new factory barrel to map and check dimensions.. The after market barrel presently in the gun is not the best example of precision  machining I 've ever seen.. The 1911 38 wad cutter guns of the early smiths such as Jimmie Clark, all used 10/12 twist .357 barrels. Accuracy was not the issue.. Magazines and feeding were a problem.. I plan to order a batch of cast bullets in the near future from PENN. Bob has a specific 52 bullet that he will size to the shooter's preference. More to follow..Smile


Last edited by Jerry Keefer on Wed Mar 18, 2015 9:19 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: HBWC vs DBBWC

Post by noylj on Mon Jan 05, 2015 4:52 pm

UMMM, since I tested nearly every L-HBWC I could in four different M52s and all showed best accuracy with Rem., I stand by my statement. You work up the load, so even if the larger bullet cause higher pressure, it is all taken care of as part of load work-up. I did not see any signs of pressure.
One critical thing I did find was that whether the bullet was 0.358" or 0.360", accuracy was destroyed if the seating step caused the bullet to be swaged down.

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Re: HBWC vs DBBWC

Post by Jerry Keefer on Mon Jan 05, 2015 5:10 pm

I didn't mean the pressure would approach high limits, it will increase slightly due to more force required to move the larger diameter projectile thru the bore. That's great that it's working for you...Remington is a great bullet..

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Re: HBWC vs DBBWC

Post by Jerry Keefer on Sun Feb 15, 2015 3:31 pm

Cutting sample chambers today.. The slug on the right is from a Shilen .357 dia. 8 lands and grooves bore.  The slug on the left is from a factory Model #52 .355 dia. 5 lands and grooves bore.  The distortion is  very evident. The slugs are Star .357 dia. HBWC.  Which one will be more accurate at 50 yards.??


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Re: HBWC vs DBBWC

Post by Jerry Keefer on Fri Mar 13, 2015 5:59 pm




Update:
We have about 1000 rounds thru this gun now.. Today the weather was decent, so I put it thru some ransom testing.. The results were...OK but not what I ultimately want. The photo shows 50 rounds thru a 50 foot slow fire target with a 10 ring over lay on top.. The group is reasonably well within the ten ring except three shots on the edge, upper right, at 1&2 oclock. Used the ammo pictured. Anxious to try some cast reloads..Need to set up/change over the Dillon.
The barrel is a Shilen 14 twist.  I have a 10 twist on order..

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Re: HBWC vs DBBWC

Post by james r chapman on Fri Mar 13, 2015 8:57 pm

So nice to have the toys, knowledge and time to do that!

Smile

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Re: HBWC vs DBBWC

Post by KenO on Fri Mar 13, 2015 9:12 pm

Very interesting pics! Where can one buy a replacement barrel for a 52?

Mine shoots the HBWCs better than my home cast DEWC at 50 yards, but about the same at 25. The HBWCs are Precision Delta.

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Re: HBWC vs DBBWC

Post by Jerry Keefer on Fri Mar 13, 2015 9:43 pm

KenO wrote:Very interesting pics! Where can one buy a replacement barrel for a 52?

Mine shoots the HBWCs better than my home cast DEWC at 50 yards, but about the same at 25. The HBWCs are Precision Delta.
I am not aware of any aftermarket barrels available.. Bar Sto at one time offered them, but I don't think they do now..
I will post some cast bullet groups as soon as I can get to it..It will be a little while..

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Re: HBWC vs DBBWC

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