Registered NRA matches

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Registered NRA matches

Post by xman on Wed Feb 18, 2015 4:28 pm

I know that registered matches are above approved matches. But dont registered matches have to follow NRA rules unless exceptions are made in the match program? I am speaking about rule #22 for allowing the use by competitors to use a .22lr for all courses but shoot for score only in the CF and .45 phases. I have come accross a series of registered matches that prohibit the use of .22 for all courses EXCEPT for juniors and nothing is said about the exception for juniors in the match program nor the exculsion of the use of .22 for open competitors shooting the courses with a .22. (I have been in contact with the match director via email) I for one cant/wont travel 5 hours for just 90 shots as I only have a .22. I would travel for 270 shots though. I thought the whole idea of rule #22 was to get more folks shooting in bulleye/precision pistol shoots, not prohibit them. Rule #22 says nothing about juniors only. I have been in touch with the NRA about this and the answer was as follows in blue type, why then the need for an official referee, jury and other registered match officials to interpet "the rules". They can make up there own rules then even when the match program says NRA rules will apply.Question

we do not require any location or sponsor to run or utilize all the rules in the NRA Precision Pistol Rulebook.  The Rulebook is a tool for the location running the matches......

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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by Schaumannk on Wed Feb 18, 2015 4:44 pm

xman wrote:I know that registered matches are above approved matches. But dont registered matches have to follow NRA rules unless exceptions are made in the match program? I am speaking about rule #22 for allowing the use by competitors to use a .22lr for all courses but shoot for score only in the CF and .45 phases. I have come accross a series of registered matches that prohibit the use of .22 for all courses EXCEPT for juniors and nothing is said about the exception for juniors in the match program nor the exculsion of the use of .22 for open competitors shooting the courses with a .22. (I have been in contact with the match director via email) I for one cant/wont travel 5 hours for just 90 shots as I only have a .22. I would travel for 270 shots though. I thought the whole idea of rule #22 was to get more folks shooting in bulleye/precision pistol shoots, not prohibit them. Rule #22 says nothing about juniors only. I have been in touch with the NRA about this and the answer was as follows in blue type, why then the need for an official referee, jury and other registered match officials to interpet "the rules". They can make up there own rules then even when the match program says NRA rules will apply.Question

we do not require any location or sponsor to run or utilize all the rules in the NRA Precision Pistol Rulebook.  The Rulebook is a tool for the location running the matches......
I think the chances are very good that these matches just haven't updated their match bulletins to reflect the fairly recent rule changes allowing 22 only.

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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by xman on Wed Feb 18, 2015 5:06 pm

the match director knows about rule#22 other wise he could not allow even juniors to shoot .22 across all phases. Still nothing was in the match program about even the junior exception. Maybe they dont want to flood the 36 position firing line with .22 shooters. Beside the rule is on the website and using an old rule book is bad practice that the referee (Unnamed at this time) should/must address. NRA publications has told me that no new rulebooks with be printed..only on line versions will be available.

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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by brassmaster on Wed Feb 18, 2015 6:28 pm

I just finished preparing the program for our annual spring regional, a registered tournament and submitted it to the NRA. This will be the first time that we will include a .22 aggregate match. Separate categories for seniors (over 21) and juniors. It will be a 2700 over two days, with firing the .22 throughout, side by side with CF & .45.There will be separate award categories, i.e., senior and junior aggregate winners. There will not be class awards.
Our primary goal is to attract more junior shooters and beginners that may have just a .22 target pistol and to encourage seniors (over 60) that may have drifted way from competitive Bullseye Shooting. We will also hold our first CMP .22 Rimfire (leg) match. Historically, at all of our registered matches we utilize the NRA Jury System rather than being assigned an NRA Referee.
Although it would be a long drive, we would be happy to have you join us for some Southern Hospitality mixed with a lot of lead!
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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by CR10X on Wed Feb 18, 2015 6:30 pm

Opinions with experience are generally more valuable than just opinions.   


Last edited by CR10X on Thu Feb 19, 2015 7:30 pm; edited 3 times in total (Reason for editing : Not worth the effort)

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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by xman on Wed Feb 18, 2015 6:58 pm

CR10X wrote:Please take the time to read all the rules.  The NRA Conventional Pistol Rules specify what has to be done for Approved or Registered.  There are numerous matches and types of competition covered by the rule book.  The match has to provide a bulletin for review by the NRA to make sure the required items are covered.  The match also has options on which matches offer, open to what classifications, divisions, etc. etc. as long as those matches offered and conditions of the contest are consistent with the applicable rules. 

 Specifically, a Registered or Approved match does not have to offer the .22 Agg and that is not "breaking the rules"  or "making up the rules" as implied above. As far as the "requirement?" for .22 aggregate match, see 22.6 below.  This indicates (along with the absence from Rule 1.6) that is it not a required Match for a Registered Tournament.  

I appreciate your wanting to shoot, but for every match (Approved or Registered) to offer all the options may be more than the match officials and stat support personnel can handle.  It is at the discretion of those putting on the match.  Some may decide not to do it due to limited participation, additional bookkeeping, providing preference to 2700 3 gun shooters, or for any number of reasons.

Sometimes they just need to know that someone want to have this opportunity.  Give them a call.  Also an offer to help out would not hurt.

I have read the rules throughly, that does not alter that fact that the match program does NOT mention that ONLY JUNIORS may compete with .22 only in all phases and leaves out as a courtesy to others that they may NOT compete in all phases with a .22. If it is good enough for "Junior" shooters then equal allowance for open shooters should be considered or denied IN THE PROGRAM. I have been in touch with the match director and he just repeats that only juniors may use a .22 all day.


Last edited by xman on Wed Feb 18, 2015 7:00 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : additional information)

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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by CR10X on Wed Feb 18, 2015 7:09 pm

Deleted


Last edited by CR10X on Thu Feb 19, 2015 7:31 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Not worth the effort)

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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by brassmaster on Wed Feb 18, 2015 8:32 pm

@CR 10X
Thanks for pointing out what some competitors take for granted. Volunteers---usually club members giving up their opportunity to participate in matches so others can. These folks give of their time and talents and most are experienced competitors.
We have a husband and wife team that ran regionals and state championships for 40+ years. All they received was thank you. We also have an old master shooter in our state that, unfortunately, due to health issues can no logger compete, but he runs his local club's monthly Bullseye Matches. He also continues to captain our state pistol teams at Camp Perry and makes all arrangements for housing, teams, etc.
For seasoned competitors it is mixed emotions of helping develop a match program, organize the match, handle all sanctioning duties and run the match, yet, giving up the opportunity to compete.
These are the unsung heroes that make our sport possible. Next match you attend, take the time to thank the organizers and the volunteers running the match and maybe even give them a handshake or a pat on the back. Without them there would not be any Bullseye Matches!
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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by xman on Wed Feb 18, 2015 10:19 pm

CR10X wrote: 

 On to the specifics.  Does the match program say there will be a .22 Only Aggregate Match? The program needs to specify a .22 Only Agg match to have  a .22 Only Agg match.  If it does, then does it specify what type of match it would be?  For example:

1.7 (e) Restricted Match - A match in which competition is limited to specified groups, i.e., juniors, women, police, civilians, veterans etc.; or to specific classes, i.e., High masters, Masters, Experts, Sharpshooters, Marksmen, etc.


To put it simply, they don't have to tell you they don't have a .22 Only Aggregate Match (they need to tell you if they do). 

To me the only issue is (if your description is complete) is they did not specify in the program that juniors are allowed to shoot during all the aggs with a .22.  However, if the juniors are not competing against any other shooters or in any of the other match aggregates (CF / .45) for awards, I'm not sure they have to say anything there either.  They are just providing a courtesy for those juniors to continue to shoot.

The same way I have the option for new shooters (any age) to shoot (not compete) using  the .22 "all day" but only the .22 Agg scores are submitted if there is space on the line not used by "3-gun" competitors that want to shoot.
Nothing in the match program about juniors competing agianst other 3 gun shooters. Just that juniors cannot receive cash awards.They can shoot agianst other juniors and open shooters in the .22 phase. I for one will not drive 5 hours and hope ther is space on the line if they might have allowed a senior shooter to shoot but not compete. But the point is moot now anyhow.

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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by Ghillieman on Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:08 pm

xman, Prescott and I have talked about holding a few approved matches in Terrell to get people classification cards. The last time I talked to someone that shot in Dallas they said that their scores were not sent in for classification either. I'm off this weekend, I plan to be in Terrell for the BE match if its not rained out. Maybe we could talk then and set up a few approved matches.
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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by TexasShooter on Thu Feb 19, 2015 4:59 am

xman - We hold an approved match in Midland every month and you would sure be welcome. I see you're in Tyler - that looks like about a 12 hour drive round trip, that's just around the corner by Texas standards Smile .

 .22 & center-fire for a total of 180 shots. Shoot whatever you want, .22 for the whole thing, center-fire for the whole thing. If someone shoots .22 for the whole match, only their .22 match score is turned in for classification and the rest is just for fun. You make the trip and I'll buy lunch...

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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by CR10X on Thu Feb 19, 2015 7:07 am

Deleted

Thanks to all the match and support people out there!


Last edited by CR10X on Thu Feb 19, 2015 7:31 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Not worth the effort)

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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by Corregidor on Thu Feb 19, 2015 9:46 am

Thank you Cecil, on behalf of all Match Directors on the List... your thoughts are, as always, acutely pertinent, level-headed, and "positive"!

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Re: Registered NRA matches

Post by xman on Thu Feb 19, 2015 11:38 am

Clay,

Send me your match info for the Midland shoots to me  tylertxman@yahoo.com

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