Crimping issues

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Crimping issues

Post by troystaten on Wed Dec 23, 2015 1:10 pm

Hello everybody for the 45 acp I have a 3 die set that has a carbide sizer die, and expanding die and a combination seating and crimping die that is stamped 45acp seat 81.  I am using a .452 diameter lead simi-wadcutter and trying to get a crimp diameter of .465 but the most crimp with this die I can get is .472 and this results in a finished cartridge that will not drop in the chamber of my barrel (plunk test) in both the cart barrel of my bulleye pistol and the factory barrel that used to be in the gun.  Would the RCBS taper seating die help me with this.  I am using a RCBS single stage press and have no desire to change to a multi stage press at this time but would be willing to seat and crimp in separate steps if needed.  I have always reloaded for 38 special and 357 but 45acp is new to me. 

thanks for your help this is a great forum.

Troy

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by fc60 on Wed Dec 23, 2015 1:23 pm

Greetings,

I never cared for the Seating/Crimping combo die. It would work well with jacketed bullets that only need the flare removed.

Visualize what happens to the soft Lead as the press ram closes. The crimp starts to move in as the bullet is moving downward. There will be shaving of Lead as the process continues.

Try to locate a old RCBS Taper Crimp die. It will have no internal threads. These old dies used to have a 4 degree per side taper.

Cheers,

Dave

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by LenV on Wed Dec 23, 2015 1:43 pm

I use Lee dies for the first 3 stages but I have found that the Dillon crimp die works the best for the final stage. They are even easier to clean now.

Len

http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/content/p/9/pid/24483/catid/4/Dillon_Crimp_Dies

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by dronning on Wed Dec 23, 2015 2:04 pm

I too use separate seating and crimping dies, most do.  I use a lee factory crimp die and a Redding competition seating die, just because it's easy to change depth when switching between my FMJ and SWC rounds.

- Dave

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by james r chapman on Wed Dec 23, 2015 2:43 pm

Take your seating die, back it of a full turn. Seat your bullets to col. Remove the seating stem. The put a case or factory round in the die and adjust it down till you get the crimp you want. Then see if it 'plunks'.

That's what 2 seperate dies will do for you.

Jim

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by Rob Kovach on Wed Dec 23, 2015 3:38 pm

I get good performance from the Lee Seat/Crimp die on lead...It just takes forever to get the adjustments right.

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by troystaten on Wed Dec 23, 2015 4:54 pm

Thanks for all the reply's.  Jim I did try just seating the bullet without crimping then once the bullet was at the correct depth (overall length) crimping without the seating stem and I could not get enough crimp.  That is where the thought of the separate RCBS seating die came to mind I would be ok with trying a different brand of die as long as it fits in my press. 

thanks

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by Jack H on Wed Dec 23, 2015 5:00 pm

troystaten wrote:Hello everybody for the 45 acp I have a 3 die set that has a carbide sizer die, and expanding die and a combination seating and crimping die that is stamped 45acp seat 81.  I am using a .452 diameter lead simi-wadcutter and trying to get a crimp diameter of .465 but the most crimp with this die I can get is .472 and this results in a finished cartridge that will not drop in the chamber of my barrel (plunk test) in both the cart barrel of my bulleye pistol and the factory barrel that used to be in the gun.  Would the RCBS taper seating die help me with this.  I am using a RCBS single stage press and have no desire to change to a multi stage press at this time but would be willing to seat and crimp in separate steps if needed.  I have always reloaded for 38 special and 357 but 45acp is new to me. 

thanks for your help this is a great forum.

Troy

If your die is a RCBS die and is marked 45acp seat 81, it is not a crimper.  It is a seater made in 1981.

Get the Dillon take apart dies.

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by troystaten on Wed Dec 23, 2015 5:24 pm

Thank you so much Jack that explains why I can't get a crimp from that die.  Have a great Christmas etc.

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by troystaten on Sun Jan 10, 2016 4:23 pm

Just received a RCBS taper crimping die and was able to get the desired crimp, also seated the bullets and crimped in two steps.  Thanks so much for all the help on this one.

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by rich.tullo on Mon Jan 11, 2016 11:07 am

james r chapman wrote:Take your seating die, back it of a full turn. Seat your bullets to col. Remove the seating stem. The put a case or factory round in the die and adjust it down till you get the crimp you want. Then see if it 'plunks'.

That's what 2 seperate dies will do for you.

Jim
Sounds like you may be Roll Crimping the above is the right way to go. I found the best taper for the 45acp in a 1911 is around 0.469. I would also use a go not go gauge. Mine is by Wilson Tools. 


I would also check your sizing if the sizing die is not set right you are only re sizing 1/3 of the case with your crimp. 


I had to readjust things this weekend going to Mangus 801's from HPSWC.

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by DavidR on Mon Jan 11, 2016 11:49 am

seating and crimping a 45 in one step for accuracy is a no no, buy a separate taper crimp die

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by Rob Kovach on Mon Jan 11, 2016 3:08 pm

seating and crimping a 45 in one step for accuracy is a no no

This is correct at 50 yards, and even then the negative impact on accuracy is small.

If all you have is the ability to seat and crimp in the same step, use that.  If you are able to seat and crimp in separate steps, use that instead.

The biggest obstacle to my training and shooting participation is time.  My Lee Pro 1000 seats and crimps in the same step.  Though it makes ammo that isn't quite as accurate as my Dillon makes, it's close to as accurate, and it saves me time.  Sometimes that time savings allows me to participate in one more league night, or one more practice session, and those things have a bigger positive impact on my performance than I lose in mechanical accuracy.

In most cases, that 6 you shot was the shooter, not the ammo.

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Re: Crimping issues

Post by troystaten on Mon Jan 11, 2016 11:41 pm

I seated and crimped in separate steps, did make it easier even though it added some additional time to the reloading process.  Unfortunately I don't get to shoot enough that extra reloading time interferes with shooting.  While not even close to being as time savings as a Dillon I can get quite a bit reloaded if I am organized with my processes.  Again thanks for everybody's help and input.

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