At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

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At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by lablover on Sun Mar 20, 2016 5:47 pm

First topic message reminder :

Like the title says, I have tried a 3.8 gr BE with a 200 gr swc.  No go..My Range Officer will not function this load...Empty cart comes half way out and then jams.

The RO has a 10 lb recoil spring in it as well as I got a new MSH with 19lb spring.  I thought for sure the new MSH and spring would work. 

I'm now at a loss...LEt me add something that may help.  My Marine Load 185gr JHP nosler and VV 4.5 N 310 works like a charm for a while but then starts to act up as the gun gets dirty.

Any Help?  Like the title says  I'm at a loss.  I thought up the BE load to 4.0 gr and try but some here have said the 3.8 works in the RO they have.

I will mention it's not that important I shoot super light loads........The Marine load is super light to me..I could go hotter if needed on any load and be more than happy.

Joe


Last edited by lablover on Sun Mar 20, 2016 5:59 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by lablover on Mon Mar 21, 2016 4:15 pm

Winchester Primers

I'll go over everything as soon as I get home!  I WILL get this figured out!

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by james r chapman on Mon Mar 21, 2016 4:27 pm

You need to simplify your changes.

Did this gun function ok before the changes? or were the changes made to make it function?

I wonder if the mainspring is not allowing the slide to fully cycle back.

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by JKR on Mon Mar 21, 2016 4:32 pm

Where are the gunsmiths on this one? There's no way you should need springs that light with a bare slide. I'm thinking ammunition problem, but I'm guessing of course.

Jim

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by lablover on Mon Mar 21, 2016 4:33 pm

james r chapman wrote:You need to simplify your changes.

Did this gun function ok before the changes? or were the changes made to make it function?

I wonder if the mainspring is not allowing the slide to fully cycle back.
Gun functioned fine when I was using 4.2 titegroup and 185 gr swchp.  Soon as I tried the 3.8 bullseye and 200 or 185 SWC no go.  So, I changed the recoil springs to a 10 lb..NO go, then I did the MSH change...still no go.  Trigger is a bit nicer however..Guess thats a plus.

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by DavidR on Mon Mar 21, 2016 5:57 pm

lablover wrote:
OldMaster66 wrote:How much crimp are you using? I crimp all my loads pretty tight. There should be a visible crimp line on the case. Too little and you won't get a consistent burn. I find it darn hard to measure but it is real easy to see.

Now here is a thought


You may be on to something here..I crimp pretty light, I don't see that line.  And, when using the BE I was getting lots of what I assumed was unburnt powder..Could that be a sign of too little crimp?
Bullseye needs to be crimped tight to get a good burn, the fact you see unburnt powder shows crimp is to light. crimp to  .469 at the minimum .467-68 would be better, also you could have weak powder have you tried other lot of BE, the fact that the gun runs with tightgroup which is not much off from BE makes me think weak or contaminated powder,

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by lablover on Mon Mar 21, 2016 5:59 pm

Time to get a bullet puller!!!

I will try another lot as well.  I don't want to try too many variables at once

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by james r chapman on Mon Mar 21, 2016 6:05 pm

lablover wrote:Time to get a bullet puller!!!

I will try another lot as well.  I don't want to try too many variables at once
+1

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by brassmaster on Mon Mar 21, 2016 6:44 pm

What a great resource of information regarding a subject that a lot of competitive Progressive Pistol Shooters wrestle when reloading 45acp---CRIMP!
OldMaster 66's link to the thread about crimp contained a watershed of information. Thanks to all who posted, viewing the different opinions of posters is both healthy and helpful.

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by 1joel1 on Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:20 am

9# spring here with optic mounted. 

Joel

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by lablover on Wed Mar 23, 2016 7:38 am

So, got a bullet puller and looked at some bullets...Seems I'm damaging the bullet a bit with my crimping now.  Very slight edge/ledge where the brass meets the shoulder....grrrrrrrrrrr


Then again, maybe I'm shaving lead on the seating process

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by james r chapman on Wed Mar 23, 2016 8:01 am

Bullet damage won't be the root problem.

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by lablover on Wed Mar 23, 2016 8:05 am

james r chapman wrote:Bullet damage won't be the root problem.
I understand...But, it's yet another issue to deal with...Good thing I have time on my hand right now...

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by lablover on Wed Mar 23, 2016 3:40 pm

*****UPDATE******

Ok then, problem solved, and I'm not really sure how it was solved.  Let me explain

Took about 20 rounds of the 50 I had and adjusted the crimp down a bit to see if that was the cause of my problems.  Took it to the range today because I had to know.  Pistol fired GREAT.  For the heck of it I tried some of the not adjusted crimp ammo and guess what, it fired fine.  So, being on a roll I put in a 14 lb spring..It all fired fine.  Well heck, I then put in a 16 lb spring and guess what..yup, it all fired fine.

So, what gives.  The only thing I can think of is before heading to the range I gave the pistol a quick cleaning after fully stripping it down, inspect and re-assemble.  Added a few drops of oil and headed out.  The gun was filthy!!!  I also bent the center leaf of the trigger spring ever so slightly because I wanted to see if that would tweek the trigger pull any.

So, Honestly..I think with the MSH change and when I put it all together something wasn't right.  Not sure what?  OR, the gun was so damn filthy (shame on me) it didn't function correctly.  OR...When I tested the first time I was outdoors and it was 40 deg out with a filthy gun and zero lube.

Anywho

I want to thank everyone for helping me out on this one.  I have to say I look forward to getting it out of my mind so I can sleep tonight..LOL

Joe

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by DavidR on Wed Mar 23, 2016 5:50 pm

or you did not oil it enough, 1911s function best when very well oiled. use lighter oil if under 50 degrees too.

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by dronning on Wed Mar 23, 2016 6:24 pm

lablover wrote:*****UPDATE******

 OR...When I tested the first time I was outdoors and it was 40 deg out with a filthy gun and zero lube.

Joe

Depending on the lube you had left in the gun while it was getting dirty some lubes will get molasses thick around 40 degrees and add the dirt, well you get the picture.  I've run massively filthy 1911's below 20 degrees but keep them wet with Amzoil 0W-20.  It has one of the lowest viscosity ratings below 40.  You can run a 1911 pretty dirty if you keep it wet with a low viscosity lube in cold weather, but if you let that crap dry out you can actually stick a slide.  During matches I use Rem oil, simply because I can get it in handy containers.

- Dave

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by C.Perkins on Wed Mar 23, 2016 6:55 pm

A clean gun is a happy gun Smile
I have been lubing mine with Remoil using Ed Masaki's lube points since shooting a 1911(and keep it wet).
I used to shoot a lot of lead but you have to clean very often from the lead and bullet lube accumulation.
Now I just shoot jacketed and cleaning is a lot less.

http://www.bullseyepistol.com/oiling.htm

Clarence

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by DavidR on Thu Mar 24, 2016 10:46 am

dronning wrote:
lablover wrote:*****UPDATE******

 OR...When I tested the first time I was outdoors and it was 40 deg out with a filthy gun and zero lube.

Joe

I've run massively filthy 1911's below 20 degrees but keep them wet with Amzoil 0W-20.  It has one of the lowest viscosity ratings below 40.  
- Dave
Actually if you went to a 0-20 in amsoil or mobil1 or Castrol you would have a much lower viscosity by almost 10 points in the 40C ratings for cold flow.  Ive found Hoppes #9 lubricating oil to be very good and only 2.99 for a 2oz bottle

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by Rob Kovach on Fri Mar 25, 2016 12:19 am

I love using Hoppe's oil as well.

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

Post by SSgtG on Fri Mar 25, 2016 7:30 am

Ditto on the keeping it wet. Here in Iowa your temp indoor or out is all over the place throughout the year. I've gone to using Marvels Mystery Oil with a touch of some slippery snot called Velocity in it year round. As an aside, using Alox as a bullet lube I get no leading either. After a full indoor season the gun still runs perfect, shoots x's, and yes it's pretty dirty. If your hand isn't a bit dirty after you are done it isn't wet enough. Nice part is, when you clean it, it is mostly a wipe down. For those you poo poo this, it's a rock river I bought in 2001. Probably 50,000 rounds down the tube. Still tight as new, still groups 2" off the bench at 50. I'm not lucky just not ocd as some about cleaning. Oh and my brass doesn't look new either, just tumbled clean.

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Re: At my wits end...RO will not function with light loads

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