Probational two handed?

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Probational two handed?

Post by Aprilian on Sat May 14, 2016 12:07 am

In reading the NRA rules, I see there is something related to allowing new shooters to use two hands with the term "Probational" (section 24).

Can someone tell me whether this is commonly done?

I doubt it is helpful to developing one-handed skills  Do you see a reason to shoot my first match with both hands?
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by cdrt on Mon May 16, 2016 9:43 am

I've only seen it done with Juniors, since some don't have the arm strength to shoot well one-handed.
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by Ghillieman on Mon May 16, 2016 9:52 am

I've been looking into this for my daughter, she is 9 and unable to hold the pistol up with only one hand, but two hands she is fine. If you can safely shoot with one hand then you should. You will be loosing your learning experience with two hands.
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by Aprilian on Mon May 16, 2016 9:58 am

Thanks Guys!   I shot my first match yesterday one-handed.
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by DavidR on Mon May 16, 2016 10:11 am

Use of two hands is only allowed in matches that are probational matches I think they are also short courses shot at 25 yds, our range hosts about two a season so if you really want to shoot a lot of matches put the other hand in your pocket. Although most matches that are just regular and not state or regional ones will let beginner's shoot with two hands and even shoot a 22 in all phases but their scores are not counted or sent into the nra.
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by jmdavis on Mon May 16, 2016 10:19 am

David, 

Wouldn't rule 22A apply to regionals or state matches as well? At least if the match director allows it.
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by Motorcycle_dan on Mon May 16, 2016 10:29 am

Just my humble opinion as a trainer coach.  If the end goal is shooting precision pistol, I believe all training should be with one hand.  If they are taught two handed, you will loose their interest as they attempt to go to one hand.
What I do.  Let them shoot for score only no prize, no classification scores.  Shoot the match using a sand bag placed on a shooting box.  Only one handed they still do sight alignment and squeeze but have the added support of their wrist (not the gun) rested on the bag to get them going.  Progress from that to rested on the bag except during sustained fire where they raise off a few inches just for the string.  (sort of like rifle shooters do using off hand stand) The points are all in slow so allow them to stay rested on the bag until they are shooting above the cut off for Marksman scores.
My experience says this method works quite well at building the skills and confidence that holds a good competitor in the game.
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by CFPlinker on Mon May 16, 2016 11:25 am

I don't think shooting two handed is very common. I have one friend who had to drop out of league shooting because of rotator cuff problems that could not be helped with surgery. She still goes to the range occassionaly but needs both hands to support the pistol. Another shooter at last years league is also having shoulder problems and said that he wishes he could shoot using both hands. 

I have no problems with doing it if the match or league program includes two handed shooting. It would be a separate category and the shooters in it would be competing among themselves not with the one handed only shooters. It looks like the NRA would issue separate Marksman, Sharpshooter, and Expert classification cards for the probationary One or Two Handed Precision Pistol Match. 

It might allow us to attract, or more likely keep, shooters that would otherwise not be participating in  our sport.


Last edited by CFPlinker on Mon May 16, 2016 11:27 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Spelling)

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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by Aprilian on Mon May 16, 2016 11:32 am

CFPlinker wrote:It might allow us to attract, or more likely keep, shooters that would otherwise not be participating in  our sport.
...and attract those from the 2-handed disciplines
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by jmdavis on Mon May 16, 2016 11:36 am

Aprilian wrote:
CFPlinker wrote:It might allow us to attract, or more likely keep, shooters that would otherwise not be participating in  our sport.
...and attract those from the 2-handed disciplines

I think that would also require targets as close as 3 yards and no more than 25 and the allowance of baricades.
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by james r chapman on Mon May 16, 2016 11:54 am

jmdavis wrote:
Aprilian wrote:
CFPlinker wrote:It might allow us to attract, or more likely keep, shooters that would otherwise not be participating in  our sport.
...and attract those from the 2-handed disciplines

I think that would also require targets as close as 3 yards and no more than 25 and the allowance of baricades.

Yepper..
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by DavidR on Mon May 16, 2016 4:30 pm

jmdavis wrote:David, 

Wouldn't rule 22A apply to regionals or state matches as well? At least if the match director allows it.
If I'm not mistaken a probational  match is held on its own, regular one handed shooters can attend too but they are also only shot at 25 yds on short course targets.
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by Regular_Guy on Mon May 16, 2016 8:12 pm

Isn't SAFS pistol allowing 2 handed as well? My goal is to head to Perry for the first time this year, is there any advantage to 2 handed other than controlling recoil better?
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by Colt711 on Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:39 pm

Rich,
Per your bio NRA has classified you a marksman. Why are you looking to take a step backwards?
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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by clark2245 on Tue Jun 14, 2016 10:24 am

DavidR wrote:
jmdavis wrote:David, 

Wouldn't rule 22A apply to regionals or state matches as well? At least if the match director allows it.
If I'm not mistaken a probational  match is held on its own, regular one handed shooters can attend too but they are also only shot at 25 yds on short course targets.
David,

When this rule came out a few years ago I did what I usually do when I am not sure about a new rule.   Picked up my phone and called the NRA office to ask.   Ended up talking to the head people in the pistol competition office at some length and they made it clear it is up to the match director whether it is a separate match or integrated in with a regular match.   I said I would be inclined to put two hand shooters at one end of the line so their 25 yard slow fire targets would not be too much of a distraction for others shooting at 50 yards and was told that was fine.   However I as match director wanted to work it.  

In several such conversations I have had with them a common theme is the match director has a lot of discretion, as long as it is done according to the letter of and in the spirit of the rules.

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Re: Probational two handed?

Post by weber1b on Tue Jun 14, 2016 10:31 am

Regular_Guy wrote:Isn't SAFS pistol allowing 2 handed as well? My goal is to head to Perry for the first time this year, is there any advantage to 2 handed other than controlling recoil better?

During the M9 match held ini conjunction with the SAFS school, you are allowed to shoot two handed.

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