M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

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M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by JWelch on Sun May 22, 2016 10:07 pm

I'm looking to get an M9 and have it improved for EIC matches.  It has been more difficult to find information on accurized M9s than 1911s. So far I've spoken with/researched 4 gunsmiths: KC Customs, Mountain Competition Pistols, Roddy Toyota and Sams Custom Gunworks. The amount of work they each do varies as well does the price (ranging from $1000 to $4000 including the cost of the pistol).

Any recommendations as to how much work to have done to an M9 (full accurization or just sights and a trigger job)? Does anyone have experience with the four gunsmith's listed above? Are there other options out there for a NM M9 that I haven't found yet? 

Thanks in advance for your insights.

JWelch

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by Jon Eulette on Sun May 22, 2016 10:16 pm

I've seen 3 of the above: not a Toyota. Basically avoid MCP. Sam's originated M9 at AMU.......pricey. KC's will get the job done for much less.
Jon

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by john bickar on Sun May 22, 2016 10:39 pm

I honestly don't know why someone just starting out would choose the M9/92 nowadays. Giant ham hands? I have little teenage girl hands, so I'm just guessing.

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by LenV on Sun May 22, 2016 10:46 pm

I had a Toyota and it shot great. I have Giant Ham hands and I still never liked the grip of the pistol. That's why I sold it.

Len

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by john bickar on Sun May 22, 2016 10:48 pm

OldMaster66 wrote:I have Giant Ham hands 

No offense, but I've seen pictures of a 1911 in your hand. "Giant" doesn't begin to describe it Very Happy

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by john bickar on Sun May 22, 2016 10:51 pm

(Seriously, it's like Frank Goza and Erich Buljung had a baby.)

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by DeweyHales on Sun May 22, 2016 10:54 pm

I earned 28 points with the Beretta on my way to legging out. With FMJs, the Beretta will beat a 1911 with FMJs. However, using 185 JHPs, the 1911 with a roll trigger is easier to shoot. Plus, add a conversion kit, you can shoot NRA conventional matches to train for CMP matches. 

If you are dead set on getting a Beretta, I earned points with an MCP and a Dave Salyer build. Both are solid and will get points. Send me a PM if you'd like more information. 

I went with the 1911 eventually for a series of reasons. People say it's tougher than the Beretta. That's not true for me. 

If your Beretta trigger ever falls below weight, you'll have a hard time finding someone at the match to help you fix it. Almost anyone at a match could remedy a similar situation with a 1911.

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by LenV on Sun May 22, 2016 11:31 pm

john bickar wrote:(Seriously, it's like Frank Goza and Erich Buljung had a baby.)

Umm, I think I resemble that insinuation.


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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by john bickar on Sun May 22, 2016 11:52 pm

That picture makes me giggle every time I see it.

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by Jon Eulette on Mon May 23, 2016 12:00 am

john bickar wrote:(Seriously, it's like Frank Goza and Erich Buljung had a baby.)

I had Frank Goza pick me up by my neck one time Smile
Frank wasn't the guy to play a prank on. At least that day. LOL.
Lumberjack!
Jon

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by Christopher Miceli on Mon May 23, 2016 6:29 am

Tony kidd use to build the m9 as well...doesn't anymore.  Another plus to the 1911 over the m9 is resale.  I've seen match m9 that seem harder to sell and fetch less than a quality used 1911.

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by BE Mike on Mon May 23, 2016 9:47 am

The military teams have had great success with the Beretta. I got my badge using a 1911 and factory hardball. After I got my Kidd Beretta, I started shooting ball matches, basically for fun. Although the Beretta was much more accurate than the 1911, I shot about nearly the same scores. However the Beretta was easier on this old bones. If you can find a good used Kidd or Sam's Beretta, you will have a pistol capable of winning ball matches and save some money. I have pretty much medium sized hands and never thought the grip was too much to handle. Even girls seem to be able to shoot the Beretta.

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by C-Train on Mon May 23, 2016 11:16 am

JWelch wrote:I'm looking to get an M9 and have it improved for EIC matches.  It has been more difficult to find information on accurized M9s than 1911s. So far I've spoken with/researched 4 gunsmiths: KC Customs, Mountain Competition Pistols, Roddy Toyota and Sams Custom Gunworks. The amount of work they each do varies as well does the price (ranging from $1000 to $4000 including the cost of the pistol).

Any recommendations as to how much work to have done to an M9 (full accurization or just sights and a trigger job)? Does anyone have experience with the four gunsmith's listed above? Are there other options out there for a NM M9 that I haven't found yet? 

Thanks in advance for your insights.

Hi JWelch,

I prefer the Beretta for service pistol competitions and have used many variations. Stock, Bar-Sto match barrel fitted by them, my own using a KKM drop-in barrel with LPA adjustable rear site and D trigger spring for a slightly smoother single action pull. I received my Sams National Match M9 in November but haven't used it in a match yet.

My best advice is to start out getting the KKM Precision drop-in barrel for the M9. It's $225 and mine required no fitting at all. The accuracy out of it was amazing to me. I'd spent a lot more money on the Bar-Sto barrel and even had them fit it, but it didn't shoot as well as the KKM drop-in by a long shot. It was the first time I felt I could call my shots at 50 yards. I would also replace the rear site with the LPA "low-profile" adjustable rear site. They make different models, the one I recommend is the low-profile that doesn't require a new front site. To install that rear site I used the Maryland Gun Works site installation tool for the Beretta. I can't imagine if I'd done it with a punch and hammer, would have caused damage no doubt. If you do that you have a pistol that will shoot extremely well at 25 & 50. I'll try to find some pics of my targets in that config from a rest to share with you.

The David Sams M9 is incredible. Very happy with it. The KKM drop-in and a trigger job will get you somewhat close to this accuracy much more affordably though. Expect to wait a year to get a David Sams M9 completed. I would avoid Mountain Competition Pistols. I've read many bad experiences with customer service, waiting over 2 years to get a gun back with little to no communication, and other horror stories. The guns themselves may shoot well, just it wouldn't be my choice.

Good luck and if you have any questions let me know!

C-Train

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by carykiteboarder on Mon May 23, 2016 2:22 pm

I bought a David Sams FS92 Brigadier because the double-stack grip fits my large hand & extra-long fingers much better than the tiny slab-sided 1911. I added a Springco recoil system recommended to me by my local High Master that has two SCG Berettas of his own. Support from SCG was terrific.  I sent them the trigger and they added a (removable) custom trigger shoe to give extra length with less than a two week turn-around.  All-in-all, it shoots like the work of art that it is.

In May, I reluctantly gave up on CMP EIC events because my vision just isn't up to iron sights.

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by Jon Eulette on Mon May 23, 2016 2:25 pm

Carykiteboarder,
Have you tried a diopter to force focus on front sight? It helped me a ton. 
Jon

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by carykiteboarder on Mon May 23, 2016 4:07 pm

Jon,
Thank you for the suggestion... getting old sucks but beats the alternative.

I have tried a Merit aperture, "eyePal" aperture, prescription Oakley shooting glasses, Champion Olympic shooting glasses with a lens from Alan Toler (Optomitrist & Master+ shooter).  For iron-sights, I can only get acceptable front sight clarity in bright light.  With (nice) covered outdoor firing lines, the shade has enough contrast that the front sight seems to be in darkness again.  Indoor is hopeless.

I'm at peace with giving up Service Pistol... beyond vision, my 11+ inch finger-span hands are not well suited for the slab side grip restrictions for Service Pistol rules. I gave it a fair try... even got intro leg points at Camp Perry in my first year SAFS... which was in bright sunshine using the Beretta with it's plump double-stack frame.

Bullseye rules allow me to shoot with sights I can see and grips that accommodate my hand.  I'm loving it.

carykiteboarder

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by Christopher Miceli on Mon May 23, 2016 4:16 pm

Would color on the front sight help you?

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

Post by Froneck on Mon May 30, 2016 10:07 am

Not sure about the other smiths mentioned but I would stay away from Mountain Competition Pistols! I've been told many bad things about his guns. Not by new shooters but by those that really know competition pistols!! I have heard good things about KC's guns though I do not have one.

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Re: M9 for EIC Matches: Seeking advice

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