Article in SSUSA

Don't know if any of you see this. It is short, but important 
https://www.ssusa.org/articles/2016/7/15/gallery-2016-sctp-and-sasp-national-team-championships/

I think perry would shutdown with 10k people

Add an extra day next year and I will show you Cardinal...

Christopher Miceli wrote:I think perry would shutdown with 10k people

There were plenty of empty huts I saw. Some might need renovating.

of course now, we're talking shotgun sports, not rifle, pistol. placing 5 shooters on a field at a time.

just imagine if you had 2600 pistol shooters on Perry's massive (400 points) firing line. imagine 7 relays for each event.

Nothing could handle that....

i guess if they ran the four ranges and 3 relays we could hold a max of 1200 competitors.  That would of been cool

That would be something to see!!

Well, this is from the Navy TImes - Aug 4 1962

THE PISTOL COMPETITION has attracted more than 2500 shooters. Before actual shooting, the Small Arms Firing School, a three-day school for the military, was held. A highlight was panel discussions which included talks by SFC William B. Blankenship of the Army who won the 1960 and 1961 National Pistol Championship, and Sgt. William S. Crawford of the White House Police Force.

So - that's 3-4 times as many shooters as we get now.

Oh - and another one (from the same edition)...

CAMP PERRY, Ohio - Camp Perry's six pistol, four rifle ranges and 320 smallbore firing points are staffed with about 2300 behind-the-scenes military support personnel who have helped set up the 1962 National Rifle and Pistol Matches - the "World Series of Marksmanship."

I have no idea if this was typical or an outlier - but it gives a comparison point.

[Edit] Those snippets came from http://www.wwmcmillan.info/index.html - which, if you have an interest in the history of Marine marksmanship is an interesting visit.

I think we had 680 competitors.

Perry's days are dwindling unless a complete overhaul is done and the nra wont fund that, cardinal will have the nationals by 2018 I bet.

DavidR wrote:Perry's days are dwindling unless a complete overhaul is done and the nra wont fund that, cardinal will have the nationals by 2018 I bet.

I overheard the NRA had signed a 10yr "agreement" to hold the Nationals at Perry.  I'm not sure if that was signed this year or 8 years ago.

- Dave

It seems that in the 80's we were over 1,000. There was a lot of enthusiasm that numbers were "going back up" and that  "another range would be needed". Apparently there was concern about the range mech as a local person asked me if the equip had been redone. He worked for a local company and had written a proposal for setting up a new system using compressors.. He was optimistic about getting the work as he thought the proposal was very reasonable and would have been done without complications. Of course I never heard a thing about any of it.
Ron Habegger

I was there in the 80's. One year they had over 1200 sign up, They were concerned that another range would have to be set-up but when the match started a few no-shows lowered the count below 1200. However on Ball day the place would pack-up. The line at registration was over 100 yards long all night (registration would be open all night) I had a friend that went there before WW2 and stayed in tents.Military scored and changed targets. 6 ranges were operating!

In contrast the money rich Bianchi cup had only 205 registered shooter's this year in what SSUSA calls the "gold standard of shooting sports".  There is no way the Bianchi Match could handle 600+ shooters.  I use to be a member of the Green Valley Rifle and Pistol Club which is the host location for Bianchi so trust me when I know what I am talking about.  If it was not for the corporate support from Midway USA and Larry Potterfield the Bianchi match would fall flat on its face.  I can remember my dad talking about going to Perry in the fifties and the numbers of shooters there.  There use to be a match in Miami Florida called the Mid-Winter Nationals that would have crowds equal to Perry every year.  The biggest problem I see for Bullseye is that it is not "sexy" to the younger crowd.  They are an instant gratification generation for the most part.  If we continue to moan and groan about low numbers, poor facilities, poor range repair, etc, etc then our sport is sure to die a slow death.  To those of you lucky enough to have a local range to compete at I envy each one of you,  the closest Bullseye match to me is a 3 hour drive.  Yes I am a member of a local gun club but we have no Bullseye facilities only the remnants from days gone by when Bullseye was the big game in town.  I am in the process of trying to bring Bullseye back to my club and raise an interest within my community about our sport.  I am trying to be a solution to the problem locally.  So, I say to all Bullseye shooters, be a solution to the problem and not be the problem.

Yep the mid-winter matches were in Tampa at a now defunct range..


great matches.. My inlaws lived in St. Pete so I always shot those matches when we were visiting..

Sorry I got the location wrong I know the last time there I was only 3 years old.  I can remember dad talking about a man that was shooting there that everybody was calling Sonny.  Dad had to ask, yep Sonny was none other than the infamous Al Capone's son, ie the nickname Sonny.

Allen Barnett wrote:In contrast the money rich Bianchi cup had only 205 registered shooter's this year in what SSUSA calls the "gold standard of shooting sports".  There is no way the Bianchi Match could handle 600+ shooters.  I use to be a member of the Green Valley Rifle and Pistol Club which is the host location for Bianchi so trust me when I know what I am talking about.  If it was not for the corporate support from Midway USA and Larry Potterfield the Bianchi match would fall flat on its face.  I can remember my dad talking about going to Perry in the fifties and the numbers of shooters there.  There use to be a match in Miami Florida called the Mid-Winter Nationals that would have crowds equal to Perry every year.  The biggest problem I see for Bullseye is that it is not "sexy" to the younger crowd.  They are an instant gratification generation for the most part.  If we continue to moan and groan about low numbers, poor facilities, poor range repair, etc, etc then our sport is sure to die a slow death.  To those of you lucky enough to have a local range to compete at I envy each one of you,  the closest Bullseye match to me is a 3 hour drive.  Yes I am a member of a local gun club but we have no Bullseye facilities only the remnants from days gone by when Bullseye was the big game in town.  I am in the process of trying to bring Bullseye back to my club and raise an interest within my community about our sport.  I am trying to be a solution to the problem locally.  So, I say to all Bullseye shooters, be a solution to the problem and not be the problem.

At Perry anyone can sign up and shoot.  For the bianchi do you have to regionally qualify?

Nope all you have to do is no different than Perry, course if you want to compete in your class you need a classification same as Bullseye.  For many years it was kind of tradition that someone from Green Valley would usually win the Marksman class and also win a fully decked out action pistol.

Allen Barnett wrote:Nope all you have to do is no different than Perry, course if you want to compete in your class you need a classification same as Bullseye.  For many years it was kind of tradition that someone from Green Valley would usually win the Marksman class and also win a fully decked out action pistol.

Wow 200 shooters... I always thought it was way more than bullseye ... So who has the largest shooting population?  3 gun?  Who holds the largest national championship?

That would be the ATA Grand American in Sparta, Illinois.

Last years attendance was over 30,000 entries.

of course, it's hard to figure because it's 2 weeks long and possibly 20+ events. each event usually has  a 1,000 to 2,000 shooters. The best number to use is targets thrown, or rounds fired. to indicate a true depth of competition. The 2015 Grand American threw 3,887,200 competition targets.

And Cardinal expects to through over 5 million this year...

Oh, Jim... 540  individual competitors were shooting pistols at cardinal 
Yes it was action pistol. But what do you think Brian Zins was doing there?

I don't have an issue. The stating true facts to answer the questions posed. Cardinal is a fantastic facility.

Jim

Danehogle wrote:Oh, Jim... 540  individual competitors were shooting pistols at cardinal 
Yes it was action pistol. But what do you think Brian Zins was doing there?

If he was there he was getting paid by someone imo,  he did several pro cardinal videos he posted all over facebook, my guess he is helping to get the nationals moved there in the future.

I read somewhere that Brian was the match director or something similar for the pistol events.

- Dave

In 1965-66 Camp Perry and the entire Port Clinton-Sandusky area was a completely different world.  The matches were supported by the military and there were thousands of extra people in the area. I was an OSP Trooper just assigned to the Baybridge Post which had policing responsibilities for the facility. 2 of us were working the 2nd shift and spent many extra hours w/ the various petty stuff and falsifications,  and thefts which occurred. Any trooper working a night shift there during the matches would likely encounter families wandering around trying to find lodging. There were way less beds in the area and many families were there for Cedar Point, East Harbor State Park, and the other commercial offerings in the area. Everything was FUUL.It was our opinion that a lot of the military assigned were personnel which their CO's were glad to get rid of for a month or 6 weeks. There were shooters all over the place. Our arrest records were up and a large share of them were associated w/ Perry, either  shooting or military support. These arrests were traffic related. I have no idea as to the numbers involved, shooters or support, but the entire area was completely changed for that period. Most every business in Port Clinton had a "National Matches" sticker on the door or in another prominent place. As we all know, today the target system is the same but much of it worn out and cannibalized to keep things going. The whole situation speaks to the dedication of the several key people who have kept the ranges in operation! 
This missive is a bit random memories but the recollections of a "senior" ex Trooper and later a shooter.
Ron Habegger