Introduction and question from rank newbie

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Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by Jorha on 1/11/2017, 2:11 pm

I'm a Service Rifle shooter and member of the Army Reserve. In planning my EIC schedule for 2017, I find that I'll be a events that allow me to shoot my maximum of four pistol EICs, one a combat match and three that are National Match Course EICs.

I'd like to make a serious, planned effort in these matches, rather than just toss lead downrange.  I would consider it a victory if I could just hit the minimum credit score and earn a CMP pin. The problem is that I have little to no experience with pistols.  My first match is mid-March. 

I've bought myself a Springfield Range Officer and plan to dry fire on my SCATT each evening. In addition, I've been doing holding drills with a 2.5 lb dumbbell while sitting at my desk at work to build the strength to shoot one-handed. Being a Soldier, I'm in relatively good shape for a 50-year-old. I've scanned the Fundaments forum and noted some books to acquire.  I have the USMC Pistol Book and the format suits my operating style, but I'm hesitant to jump into the deep end.  I'm an independent shooter and don't have unlimited funds for ammo. I don't want to shoot for the sake of shooting, but would rather ensure I'm getting something out of each session. 

What training would you suggest to get someone from rock bottom to point where range trips are productive?

Jorha

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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by jmdavis on 1/11/2017, 2:30 pm

Do you have the ability to reload 45? Do you have a 22 pistol? 

The thing about the handbook is that it does keep you on task to get something out of every shooting session, whether you complete the objective that session or not. 

In Columbus you have the option to try to make the Oak Harbor winter 2700 matches, there will be good shooters there. Some will likely be willing to offer you advice and maybe even some coaching. 

Shooting the 45 for Bullseye is likely the hardest thing I have ever done. I liken it to shooting at 1000 yards, but a bit harder. On the other hand it is absolutely doable. But will they let you shoot the 45 for the Combat match?
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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by mspingeld on 1/11/2017, 2:35 pm

I've read just about everything about pistol shooting and my highest recommendation, which is free, is to read the series of Ed Hall articles found Here. Links to each part are at the end of the previous or PM me and I can send you a PDF of the whole series.

If you can find a local league, jump in. It's great training without costing a fortune and you'll meet a bunch of people who can offer advice.

Regarding the Scatt, it's a great tool if used correctly. There was a string on this forum recently on that very subject with some astute comments by, again, Ed Hall. Link

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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by sixftunda on 1/11/2017, 2:49 pm

Hello Jorha.

There are a number of shooters in the Columbus who can help you out.  There are leagues at Vances and Aimhi in New Albany.

I am the Interim Pistol Director for Ohio.  Feel free to email me at pistol@orpa.net and we will get you squared away.
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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by Chris Miceli on 1/11/2017, 3:10 pm

You're lucky Ohio has lots of quality shooters. I recommend the Fleet forces(navy) matchs for you. Lots of shooters and if you're decent you'll take in some points. Cmp games has good turn out, camp perry has 3 matches. The m9 match(if you have no points) the EIC, and the national individual
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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by weber1b on 1/11/2017, 4:03 pm

Also, you may be reading some old rules. You now are allowed 5 EIC matches in a calendar year, plus the National championship for a total of 6 chances.

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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by Jorha on 1/11/2017, 5:06 pm

Thanks for the feedback thus far.  There's a lot going on here, so my apologies in advance for the following multiple replies.

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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by Jorha on 1/11/2017, 5:44 pm

jmdavis wrote:Do you have the ability to reload 45? Do you have a 22 pistol? 

But will they let you shoot the 45 for the Combat match?

I have a reloading press, but do not reload yet.  I made the determination that the time I have available is best spent on fundamentals training with SCATT and air rifle, rather than reloading.  At this point in my career (high Expert), shooting factory ammo is not holding me back.

I have a Ruger Mark II Target with 6.875 in tapered barrel.  Is it worth shooting that for practice or is the sight picture and trigger so different as to be no help?

Army Combat EICs are shot with rack-grade M9s.  No commercial-equivalent pistols are allowed.  Even the M9 Commercial that I own is not allowed.

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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by Jorha on 1/11/2017, 5:48 pm

Chris Miceli wrote:You're lucky Ohio has lots of quality shooters. I recommend the Fleet forces(navy) matchs for you. Lots of shooters and if you're decent you'll take in some points. Cmp games has good turn out, camp perry has 3 matches. The m9 match(if you have no points) the EIC, and the national individual


I'm going to the East Fleet match and that was the motivation for this effort.  Army Regulation 350-66 governs my participation in EICs.  Unfortunately, Soldiers are expressly prohibited from participating in the introductory matches at Camp Perry.

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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by Jorha on 1/11/2017, 5:50 pm

weber1b wrote:Also, you may be reading some old rules. You now are allowed 5 EIC matches in a calendar year, plus the National championship for a total of 6 chances.



The Army's EIC program has different rules from the CMP program.  Army Regulation 350-66 limits me to only 4 EICs per year.

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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by DavidR on 1/11/2017, 5:53 pm

I thought i read somewhere they removed the restrictions on the number of matches you can shoot?
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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by shoot308 on 1/11/2017, 7:49 pm

I to also crossed over from service rifle last fall. Went with the Guard Team to Columbia,TN for my first match. Talk about humbling. Remember learning to shoot off hand? Well this is like that, the sights/dot hardly ever stop moving. Dry fire a lot, especially on a blank wall to start so you can break trigger without sights moving then add in a target. Take good notes and start a shooting journal. 

SFC Brian Rautanen

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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by robert84010 on 1/12/2017, 10:35 am

The Ruger you have will work fine although it will probably need a trigger job. In theory the SCATT should be the same as firing a shot but in practice, I found, it is not the same. You will probably get much more improvement by buying a case of reliable .22lr and getting to the range often and doing the workbook drills. Use the workbook to set goals for each range session. The SCATT is better than nothing but I found more improvements through range time. 
Try and get to an NRA match before the fleet match, being comfortable with all the commands and structure of a pistol match goes a long way.

dry fire, dry fire, dry fire......

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Re: Introduction and question from rank newbie

Post by Chris Miceli on 1/12/2017, 1:36 pm

Jorha wrote:
Chris Miceli wrote:You're lucky Ohio has lots of quality shooters. I recommend the Fleet forces(navy) matchs for you. Lots of shooters and if you're decent you'll take in some points. Cmp games has good turn out, camp perry has 3 matches. The m9 match(if you have no points) the EIC, and the national individual


I'm going to the East Fleet match and that was the motivation for this effort.  Army Regulation 350-66 governs my participation in EICs.  Unfortunately, Soldiers are expressly prohibited from participating in the introductory matches at Camp Perry.
Shoot rifle while you're there if need the points.  Dry fire is very very very important for trigger control and sight alignment I THINK it helps greatly at 50 yards and timed fire, but for rapid fire with a 45 you need to get some time on the range. Recoil recovery, getting on the trigger while you come back into the black, and shooting the turn.
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