Recoil "feel"....

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Recoil "feel"....

Post by ST BERNARD on 1/15/2017, 7:18 am

Shot the Colt for the first time yesterday with the dot sight on it. It tosses the empties out the port about a foot and the slide locks back as it should....feeds and goes  into battery fine. The recoil feels like it has a secondary push...not sure how to describe it other than that.  Sort of a double shuffle thing that might be all in my head?  Don't mind it one bit as all the shots went into the black for the first time ever, but don't want to hurt the pistol either.
   One inch Ultra Dot and rings on a Marvel rib.  3.8 grains WST and 200 grain Summers SWC. Stock Gold Cup recoil spring (16 pound) and stock hammer spring which is supposed to be 23 pound. Firing pin stop is factory round bottom. Also shock buffer on spring guide which can't hurt.  What should we be looking for here to find the right balance?  It runs and hits where I want it to (most of the time) and just wondering if there's a way to smooth it out some more. Have a full length guide rod and EGW bushing on the way for next weekend and the gunsmith has plenty of different springs to try. Or maybe the rookie shooter just needs to make friends with the gun, and quit tinkering with it (half the fun for said rookie).
                                                                                                      As always, thanks in advance Gentlemen;
                                                                                                                                                                       Bill

ST BERNARD

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Re: Recoil "feel"....

Post by LenV on 1/15/2017, 7:34 am

The shock buffer is what your feeling in that second push. Try a couple rounds without it to tell difference.

Len
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Re: Recoil "feel"....

Post by Wobbley on 1/15/2017, 7:45 am

What you are feeling is common on recoil operated guns.  It is a mass balance thing.  A classic example is the recoil feel of the Browning Auto-5 shotgun.

It is caused by the two masses in the system.  The fixed parts don't absorb much impulse when the ground goes off because the recoiling parts absorb most of recoil impulse to operate the system.  The fixed parts then absorb the impulse of the operating parts when they hit your shock buffer.  

You can mitigate it some by springs and firing pin stop radii to force the two parts to stay together for a few nanoseconds more, but at some point reliability becomes an issue.

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Re: Recoil "feel"....

Post by ST BERNARD on 1/15/2017, 7:57 am

Thank you Len...I'll try that. Just don't want the gun to beat itself up if we can help it. The "feel of a A-5" describes it perfectly Wobbley...seems like the recoil impulse is slower now.  If this is normal, we'll leave the recipe as is and shoot the heck out of it.
                                                           Thanks again;
                                                                                    Bill

ST BERNARD

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Re: Recoil "feel"....

Post by willnewton on 1/15/2017, 9:25 am

ST BERNARD wrote:Just don't want the gun to beat itself up if we can help it.

Not going to happen with target loads and a correctly made pistol.

  I had a buffer at one time too and the slide action always seemed a bit off.  I had one installed from day one because that is what you do when you buy a 1911, right?  Everyone else has one, I must need one too.  Rolling Eyes

Tossing the shock buffer was a good upgrade for my gun and made no noticeable difference in felt recoil.  The gun cycled smoother at full spring compression, where before it seemed a bit draggy at the turnaround point.

I put the buffers in my pile of "snake-oil" shooting accessories.
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Re: Recoil "feel"....

Post by jglenn21 on 1/15/2017, 10:55 am

toss the buffer as said .. just something to break and foul the gun.

nothing to be gained by the one piece recoil guide either...


try droping down to a 11 -12  lb recoil spring and a 19 lb mainspring..

a BE  gunsmith fit barrel will help a bit with recoil( longer lower lug area)...

then just learn to shoot it

the EGW flat firing pin stop does help with "felt" recoil if you use a small radius. I use a more standard radius on mine for a wad gun...for EIC I do use a very small radius on the stop.
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Re: Recoil "feel"....

Post by Merick on 1/15/2017, 11:52 am

At the end of the day Newton will be paid and total recoil will be determined by your ammo, especially the powder charge. 

However he will take installments over time to effect felt recoil. importance of barrel fit aside;
-Small radius firing pin block takes its share of force to compress the mainspring much sooner than a large radius. 
-Love them or hate them buffers transfer force over more time than steel on steel.
-Full length guide rods have a bad rap for a lot of tall promises, but I challenge anyone to show me how they have less mass than the GI system.

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