Question for the group

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Question for the group

Post by Multiracer on 12/18/2017, 10:24 am

Does anyone have some good feedback regarding the line of Ohaus beam scales named Dial-O-Grain ?

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Re: Question for the group

Post by DavidR on 12/18/2017, 11:46 am

the old ohaus stuff is good, I had a few and they worked well,
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Re: Question for the group

Post by Multiracer on 12/18/2017, 11:57 am

Why "had" ? What did you replace it with ?

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Re: Question for the group

Post by Chris Miceli on 12/18/2017, 12:19 pm

electronic is better
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Re: Question for the group

Post by Bullseye_Stan on 12/18/2017, 12:46 pm

I don't think the 'Dial-O-Grain' scale is made any more.  All the Ohaus scales appear to be in grams (i.e. metric) now.  Not the same scale.  LEE, RCBS, DILLON, and HORNADY all make scales that have a +/- 0.1 grain resolution, suitable for reloading. 

The thing about a mechanical (balance) scale made from metal is that it never needs batteries, never has the electronics go bad, and as long as gravity is constant will always be accurate.  I'm not so sure about plastic scales that can deteriorate over time.

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Re: Question for the group

Post by Magload on 12/18/2017, 1:00 pm

Always be accurate is not quite true.  Maybe always be accurate enough for reloading  but they require calibration and certification depending on what they are being used for.  Don
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Re: Question for the group

Post by Multiracer on 12/18/2017, 1:27 pm

Chris Miceli wrote:electronic is better

Why ?

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Re: Question for the group

Post by Bullseye_Stan on 12/18/2017, 1:31 pm

Yes, accurate enough, would be correct.  I have found that the metal balance powder grain scales I've used have a 'built-in' calibration associated with the design of the scale which is altered using a screw and gravity to zero the scale.  For whatever reason, triple beam balance scales have a tendency to be more out of calibration.  I expect that is due to their increased complexity and wider range of operation.  It's always a good idea to check the calibration with a known weight that is similar to what you intend to measure.  Measuring 4.0 grains is close to zero for (my) pistol loads.  If 100 grains of powder was needed to be measured accurately, a 100 grain calibration weight would be useful.  The accuracy of that calibration weight(s) is then a question.

For my money, and knowing something about metrology, the Dillon 13480 powder scale is what I have bought directly from Dillon.  It's made by Ohaus, all metal, and will long out-last me with all the accuracy needed.  Electronics are convenient and have some nice features, but load cell technology (unless it's very expensive) is not as accurate or reliable as a weight and gravity for the cost. It's not for everyone, and I don't mean to imply that it is. 



Last edited by Bullseye_Stan on 12/19/2017, 8:03 am; edited 4 times in total

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Re: Question for the group

Post by Wobbley on 12/18/2017, 1:35 pm

I own a Dial-O-Grain. Very good scale. But electronic is much better.
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Re: Question for the group

Post by Tim:H11 on 12/18/2017, 2:34 pm

I have my great grandfathers Lyman balance beam scale. Very accurate and reliable. I have tried some lesser expensive digital ones and hated em. If I had a very expensive quality digital scale, that might be a different story but I like the Lyman. I haven’t used anything better yet.
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Re: Question for the group

Post by fc60 on 12/18/2017, 4:53 pm

Greetings,

The "Dial-O-Grain" scales use a torsion spring behind the knob. If it fails, odds are no one is still alive that can repair one.

I have one that is Metric and it is not my first choice.

The 5-10 or 10-10 scales are much nicer and affordable.

Cheers,

Dave
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Re: Question for the group

Post by fpk on 12/18/2017, 4:57 pm

Multiracer wrote:
Chris Miceli wrote:electronic is better

Why ?
Cheaper, more precision, easier to pack and travel with, etc.  Just need to validate that it is calibrated occasionally and it is altogether a better experience.

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Re: Question for the group

Post by wizzer on 12/18/2017, 5:39 pm

I had one somewhere around 35 years ago, don't know whatever became of it.  I now use an electronic GemPro.  Accurate, reliable, qiuck, not too expensive.

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Re: Question for the group

Post by jglenn21 on 12/18/2017, 5:46 pm

if you can find one for a decent price the Lyman M5 is one of the best Ohaus beam scales made. highly prized these days.. the older Ohaus D5 is a good one too. nothing to break on these other than the beam itself.



Electronic scales can be very good but the good ones cost some $$.. even the better ones need to be warmed up.. having it on a separate circuit helps for it to be as repeatable as a good beam scale..
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Re: Question for the group

Post by robert84010 on 12/19/2017, 9:13 pm

Multiracer wrote:Does anyone have some good feedback regarding the line of Ohaus beam scales named Dial-O-Grain ?
You didn't really state your intended use but for general pistol usage I would recommend a digital, I started with a simple PACT. For more precision use, like 1000 yard NRA high power rifle use I would recommend a simple Redding Model 2 balance. With a simple tuning by a guy in California you can see balance deflection from a single kernel of Varget type stick powder. I think I have $125 into mine with the tuning and using check weights it is very repeatable and accurate in weight.  Single digit SD velocity is repeatable.

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Re: Question for the group

Post by Multiracer on 12/20/2017, 6:03 am

Thanks guys,
I ordered a Pact and will keep quietly looking for a small O Haus type beam.
Ron

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Re: Question for the group

Post by Chris Miceli on 12/20/2017, 6:24 am

Multiracer wrote:Thanks guys,
I ordered a Pact and will keep quietly looking for a small O Haus type beam.
Ron
Booo Smile    

get an analytical scale and be a cool guy. This is the new version to the Satorius GD503......i feel much better knowing that my scale reads down to 0.0001 grams.....but its complete overkill  

http://balance.balances.com/scales/569


Last edited by Chris Miceli on 12/20/2017, 12:44 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Question for the group

Post by messenger on 12/20/2017, 7:58 am

I've been using a Satorius for years. I like it reading to the 1/100's grains. It's a little pricey though.

Bill
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Re: Question for the group

Post by Multiracer on 12/20/2017, 12:34 pm

Nope, not for a few 50 yard pieces of lead. Sorry, but I will keep suffering and using the equipment I have as reference to my ammunition only.
cyclops cyclops

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Re: Question for the group

Post by Jack H on 12/20/2017, 2:09 pm

Dad and I in our benchrest rifle days used both the dial scale and M5 scale.  I recall no appreciable difference.  The M5 was a little faster, and I preferred it, and use it today.  I have two electric scales, a Pact and some generic that was pushed by this list 5-6 years ago. 

I just weighed the 260.9gr test wt from the M5 on each electric scale.  260.7 and 260.5 on them.  The 5gr test was 4.9 and 4.7 on the two electrics.  I trust gravity and visual beam deflection a lot more than I trust calibration.
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Re: Question for the group

Post by Multiracer on 12/20/2017, 2:20 pm

Here is another question for the group.  Lets use Jack H's rifle days as an example.
He was shooting really well, testing ammo loads on his electronic scales, he found the perfect amount of grains of powder to improve his shooting. Did Jack H know his electronic scales were ever so slightly off or did he compensate through testing and arrive at the correct shooting score that suited him and his equipment ?

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Re: Question for the group

Post by STEVE SAMELAK on 12/20/2017, 2:30 pm

There in lies a good question....is that charge 23.2 gr 748 with a 77gr match king or is it something close that grouped really good?

I start with the middle of the "safe range" in the book then adjust to what works best in that range.

The man with two watches never really knows what time it is.
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Re: Question for the group

Post by robert84010 on 12/20/2017, 3:41 pm

Multiracer wrote:Here is another question for the group.  Lets use Jack H's rifle days as an example.
He was shooting really well, testing ammo loads on his electronic scales, he found the perfect amount of grains of powder to improve his shooting. Did Jack H know his electronic scales were ever so slightly off or did he compensate through testing and arrive at the correct shooting score that suited him and his equipment ?
That is why some of us are more concerned with repeatability and remeasure a weight or pan load 20 times in a row and verify the repeatability. My Redding is tuned for that and is repeats very accurately. I really don't care too much if it is exactly 45.5 grains of 4064 when that is dialed in, all I know is whatever the amount is produces great SD/ES and shots on call with the majority of the group in half moa of vertical dispersion when I do my part at 600.

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Re: Question for the group

Post by Aprilian on 12/20/2017, 4:06 pm

I found my cabella's brand electronic was not repeatable on light charge measurements.   I took it back and got my money back as a possible .2 grain difference of trying to match someone else's 25 yd .45 recipe (I don't have a chrono) was not what I wanted to do.

I too trust gravity despite it seeming to increase as I age  Smile
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Re: Question for the group

Post by Multiracer on 12/20/2017, 6:11 pm

Aprilian wrote:I found my cabella's brand electronic was not repeatable on light charge measurements.   I took it back and got my money back as a possible .2 grain difference of trying to match someone else's 25 yd .45 recipe (I don't have a chrono) was not what I wanted to do.

I too trust gravity despite it seeming to increase as I age  Smile

This is kind of what started this thread. I had a chincy electronic, it was good one day and poor the next. .2 Gr differential every time the pan came off and back on was becoming the norm.
So I spent for the classy RCBS unit.....what a pile of shit that thing is. It wont even repeat a calibration with the provided test weights. It too has a .2 gn differential every time the pan comes on and off.

Like I said, I spent a little again and I am still going to be scrounging around for a beam scale.
Thanks fellas
Ron

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