Please educate me about 32ACP

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Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by javaduke on 3/5/2018, 2:13 pm

Well, I'm trying to get an idea if I even want. to go down this path. So I'm thinking about getting a Pardini in 32ACP and have a few questions:

1. Is it true that 32ACP is more accurate than 32S&W? 
2. Are there good factory loads that shoot well in Pardini?
3. What are the good load recipes (if possible, with Alliant BE powder, since I use it for my 45 and 38 and just don't want to mess with multiple different powders).

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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by Jon Eulette on 3/5/2018, 3:16 pm

Look on Target Talk. Lot's of info there!
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by javaduke on 3/5/2018, 4:44 pm

Thanks, Jon, I've been going through those 23 pages of info, but unfortunately, I can't find answers to my questions. 32ACP seems to be fairly accurate, but I'm still not sure what the recipe is using the Bullseye powder, and whether there are good factory brands (I understand that Fiocchi is not working due to the smaller bullet diameter).

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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by Jon Eulette on 3/5/2018, 4:49 pm

Chris Miceli had a .32 acp built with a liner that shot 0.8" 10 shot groups with Hornady factory ammo 60 gr xtp bullets. I'm going to be trying some reloads with BE in near future.....if I ever get time Smile
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by RJP on 3/5/2018, 5:52 pm

The inherant accuracy of any caliber depends more on the quality of the gun and ammo rather than the size or shape of the cartridge. Note the differences in .22LR guns and ammo. Some shoot great and others are junk.

32 ACP shoots a more aerodynamically stable bullet compared to the wad cutter of the 32 SWLong.  Most bullets available for the 32 ACP are 60 gr and the 32 SWLong are a bit heavier. Both are just fine at 25 yards/meters. The real difference comes in at 50 yards for Bullseye shooting. 32 SWLong can be made to shoot to 50 yards with a faster twist than standard barrel. However, you are still shooting a wad cutter bullet. The faster and more aerodynamic round nose of the 32 ACP seems to have an edge, but that is not verified by what is shooting on the range. The round nose 32 ACP bullet may feed easier in a semi-auto pistol.

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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by zanemoseley on 3/5/2018, 7:26 pm

I've been on the fence about a 32acp for a couple years. Some challenges in reloading are the extremely small charge drops which can be challenging with a progressive press. Also the Pardini barrel is a bit "generous" in bore diameter which makes finding a good lead bullet more challenging. If you're fine shelling out the cash for the Hornady jacketed bullets its a bit less of an issue.

As for factory ammo, the Hornady is the only one I've heard good stuff about, its pretty spending and made in limited runs, currently out of stock at Midway.

Then there is the debate and challenge about mounting a dot on the Pardini pistols, currently I think the Kodiak mount with an Aimpoint micro is the ticket. After the pistol cost, mount, Aimpoint Micro and reloading gadgets you get to $4k pretty quick. Its a big pill to swallow for something tricky to load.

From most reports the 50 yard accuracy of 32acp is far above 32 S&W.

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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by joy2shoot on 3/5/2018, 9:10 pm

javaduke, below is a favorite recipe for some of the shooters in my league.  Pardini USA told us that a good muzzle velocity from the Pardini pistol would be around 880fps.

bullet: Hornady JHP XTP 60 gr
powder: 2.1 gr of Bullseye
crimp: 0.330"
OAL: 0.895"

When I first tried reloading .32 ACP, I followed Hornday's published reloading data.  Big mistake.  Got several squibs.

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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by zanemoseley on 3/5/2018, 10:19 pm

Joy2shoot, what kind of reloading dies are you running. Single stage or progressive? I've read on target talk about people with all kinds of custom expanders and other dies. The xtp 60 grain is one of the only reasons I'm still considering a 32acp.

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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by Jon Eulette on 3/5/2018, 10:59 pm

Wow 880 fps seems hot! I'll borrow my friends Labradar when I test my loads.
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by Bullseye_Stan on 3/6/2018, 7:17 am

From what I've read and discerned, either go with the Hornady 60 gr JHP bullet or learn to cast lead bullets using one of the dies talked about on Targettalk.  I've reloaded the 32 acp for a Cheetah, and 880 fps with a 75 grain Rim Rock Bullet does not have bad recoil.  There is a 60 grain lead bullet mold for the 32 acp which allows some customization.  Also, from my understanding, Pardini uses a .314" diameter bore where most 32 acp bores are 0.311".  The 0.314" bore is that of a 32 S&W long. 

With 2 grains of Bullseye under the 75 grain bullet, accuracy was acceptable (for the 3.8" barrel Beretta) and recoil was not bad.  I can't say what it would be like in a Pardini, but am not prepared for that $3200.00 experiment at this point.  Maybe someday - when I get my bullet casting sorted.

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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by Chris Miceli on 3/6/2018, 7:33 am

the 60 lswc for 32acp was designed around the Pardini barrel.
https://tbbullets.com/bullets/handgun-bullets/32-2/

Bullseye_stan is correct i think.. from what i understand pardini took the 32s&w L barrel and just chambered it in 32acp same slow twist and bore they've always used.
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by javaduke on 3/6/2018, 7:44 am

OK, thanks everyone, I think I get the picture. To sum it up, Hornady 60 gr is a standard, but there are 32 caliber 60gr LSWC bullets designed for Pardini, the load is around 2gr BE - seems like a bit of a challenge but doable. The new Pardinis have rail on the barrel, so perhaps I can mound a small dot (like Vortex) directly in front of a gun, or use Ultradot with some sort of cantilever mount.

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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by Chris Miceli on 3/6/2018, 7:57 am

javaduke wrote:OK, thanks everyone, I think I get the picture. To sum it up, Hornady 60 gr is a standard, but there are 32 caliber 60gr LSWC bullets designed for Pardini, the load is around 2gr BE - seems like a bit of a challenge but doable. The new Pardinis have rail on the barrel, so perhaps I can mound a small dot (like Vortex) directly in front of a gun, or use Ultradot with some sort of cantilever mount.
buy the kodiak base and an aimpoint micro or use rings that are cut to the correct angle and mount scope my normal 

https://kcskustomcreations.com/product/kodiak-machine-pardini-mount/
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by carykiteboarder on 3/6/2018, 9:16 am

zanemoseley wrote:Joy2shoot, what kind of reloading dies are you running. Single stage or progressive? I've read on target talk about people with all kinds of custom expanders and other dies. The xtp 60 grain is one of the only reasons I'm still considering a 32acp.
Zane,
On a Dillon 650:

  • I deprime and size before cleaning.  I have a toolhead with just a Hornady sizing die for this.  Thus, all clean brass enters my final reloading process already sized.
  • On my loading toolhead, I have a Lyman "Neck Expander M Die" in station 1. (See below)
  • I use the Dillon powder funnel set for zero case mouth expansion.  The powder bar is either Dillon X-small (with UniqueTek micrometer) or "Arrodondo" bar.
  • I use the Hornady seating die with "microjust" stem.  The "M" expander from station 1 ensures the bullet sits vertically on the case so there is no rotation of the bullet in the seating process.  Especially with hand placement of the bullets, a case flared only with the Dillon powder funnel is unstable and you have to be extra diligent to be sure the bullet does not enter the seating die tilted.
  • I use the Redding Taper Crimp die.

In general, reloading for .32ACP works great.  The tolerances are tight so things need to be adjusted properly and your technique careful and smooth.  No "yank and crank"!

My hands are big and the bullets small so I found placing the tiny bullets on the cases by hand to be awkward.  (I have no trouble with .45ACP.) It's not really necessary but I was able to adapt a Mr. Bulletfeeder 9mm die ($49.95) and a "Mini Mr. Bulletfeeder 6-tube magazine - Rifle .308" ($55.00) into a case-activated bullet feed system. That's a different project but I mention it to explain why I have the Lyman M expander in station one instead of station 3.
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by Chris Miceli on 3/6/2018, 9:29 am

Star reloader with custom sizing die,expander and powder funnel. The sizing die is for the hornady 60xtp, if i wanted to use lead would need a larger sizing die.
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by carykiteboarder on 3/6/2018, 9:36 am

javaduke wrote:Well, I'm trying to get an idea if I even want. to go down this path. So I'm thinking about getting a Pardini in 32ACP and have a few questions:

1. Is it true that 32ACP is more accurate than 32S&W? 
2. Are there good factory loads that shoot well in Pardini?
3. What are the good load recipes (if possible, with Alliant BE powder, since I use it for my 45 and 38 and just don't want to mess with multiple different powders).

Javaduke,
For factory loads in a Pardini .32ACP, either Hornady  60gr XTP JHP or PMC Bronze 60gr JHP are very accurate.  When I chrono'd them a couple years ago, they were in the 950+ fps velocity range.  If you have any feeding issues with either factory or reloaded ammo, try using a .22 magazine spring in one of your .32 magazines.  That's what I'm using in all my .32ACP mags.
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by joy2shoot on 3/6/2018, 2:38 pm

zanemoseley wrote:Joy2shoot, what kind of reloading dies are you running. Single stage or progressive? I've read on target talk about people with all kinds of custom expanders and other dies. The xtp 60 grain is one of the only reasons I'm still considering a 32acp.

zamemoseley,

Pretty much what Carykiteboarder said (except I use a Dillon 550).  I would not bother with the Arredondo powder bar.  When I first started reloading .32ACP I knew that I would be reloading very small charges.  So I researched what powder bar would give me the most consistent charges when working with small loads.  I purchased an Arredondo with the UniqueTek micrometer.  I already owned a Dillon ExtraSmall powder bar with the UniqueTek micrometer.  So I ran tests on both to see how much better the Arredondo was and to my surprise, the Dillon was slightly better.  But if you use a Dillon powder measure, I strongly suggest you add the UniqueTek micrometer to the powder bar.  Its threads are much finer than the standard Dillon adjustment bolt and when working with charges in the 2 gr area, you need that additional accuracy.

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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by fc60 on 3/6/2018, 7:26 pm



Pardini Factory barrel fired at 50 yards via barrel tester.

Hornady 60XTP Custom commercial ammo.
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by troystaten on 3/6/2018, 10:49 pm

Pretty impressive work fc60 do you think the velocity spread (I don't know if what you showed is a large spread or not) effects accuracy much and is the spread caused by trying to accurately meter small powder charges?

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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by Jwhelan939 on 3/6/2018, 10:57 pm

I follow the step expansion that is explained on TT. I save a ton of money shooting the T&b 314 lswc. With new brass its a bit  of a process, but I have had great luck with it. I used bullseye at first, but I seem to have a bit better accuracy and less sight adjustment with n310. I do use the arendando bar on my 650.

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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by fc60 on 3/7/2018, 11:13 am

Greetings,

The group I posted is typical.

There is no guarantee that the box of commercial ammo will shoot X-ring.

I have noticed wide velocity spreads with 32 ACP ammo. Even so, some shoot very well with a wide spread. Not sure why. If you play with a ballistic program the bullet drop is not that much at 50 yards.

I like minimal Velocity Spread as it recoils more consistently off hand.

Reloading and testing is the only way to obtain excellent results.

Best regards,

Dave
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by troystaten on 3/7/2018, 1:55 pm

Thanks Dave, I like seeing this sort of info, even if my lack of skill is the biggest reason for my scores being what they are, knowing that the shots out of the 10 ring are because of me not the gun helps.

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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by Toz35m on 3/8/2018, 11:19 pm

Someone on target talk posted a 2 page file with the results of testing many 32ACP loads.  1.6-1.8gr N310 all produced x ring groups with the bullet from T&B bullets.
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by Ghillieman on 3/9/2018, 3:08 am

I have had really good results with Hodgdon Titewad powder, loading for 32 S&W Long.
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

Post by fc60 on 3/9/2018, 12:33 pm

Someone on target talk posted a 2 page file with the results of testing many 32ACP loads.  1.6-1.8gr N310 all produced x ring groups with the bullet from T&B bullets.

Please post a link to this data. I would like to view it.

Cheers,

Dave
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Re: Please educate me about 32ACP

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