How light it too light?

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How light it too light?

Post by Dockokol on 3/8/2018, 8:03 am

I have been using 4.5 bullseye with a nosler 185jhp for the 50 yard and 25 yard line.  Id like to reduce the powder charge for the short line, but I don't want to go so light that I have to find a wooden dowel to get the nosler out of the barrel.  I was thinking using 4.0 as the lowest test charge.  I understand its a balance of how light vs which still holds a group but is 4.0 too light to clear the barrel?

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Re: How light it too light?

Post by Dcforman on 3/8/2018, 8:09 am

My understanding is that you'll get failure to eject far before you'll get any squibs. Load up some rounds at 4.4, 4.2, 4.0, 3.8, and work your way down. If you start to get failure to eject at 4.0, don't try the 3.8!

That being said I'm pretty new to this. Let the experts chime in.

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Re: How light it too light?

Post by Ed Hall on 3/8/2018, 8:18 am

My base 25 yard load is 4.0gn Bullseye with Nosler or Zero 185gn JHP.

I, too, load 4.5gn Bullseye for 50 yards.

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Re: How light it too light?

Post by BE Mike on 3/8/2018, 8:22 am

My question is, Why use those expensive bullets at the short line?
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Re: How light it too light?

Post by LenV on 3/8/2018, 10:01 am

I use 4.6 for the long line with 185 Zero, XTP or HAP but switch to 3.8 gr and 185 L-SWC for the short line. Usually with no change of sights. I also have to change magazines.

Len
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Re: How light it too light?

Post by JayhawkNavy02 on 3/8/2018, 1:10 pm

BE Mike wrote:My question is, Why use those expensive bullets at the short line?

EIC matches Smile
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Re: How light it too light?

Post by willnewton on 3/8/2018, 3:44 pm

3.8gn of BE with JHP is no problem whatsoever.

Why? Reloading is cheap. Possibly less lead exposure overall. I use JHP for many of my .45s and lead for others.  And because I can load whatever I like.

 Also, you are asking folks with more invested in their guns and gear than most decent used cars about saving a few pennies?  Smile
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Re: How light it too light?

Post by james r chapman on 3/8/2018, 3:55 pm

Like Trapshooters with $20,000 Krieghoffs shooting imported crap shells to save a 5¢
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Re: How light it too light?

Post by Ed Hall on 3/8/2018, 4:52 pm

BE Mike wrote:My question is, Why use those expensive bullets at the short line?
I used to shoot jacketed at 50 and lead at 25, but I had to clean my gun at lunch so I didn't run copper over lead in the .45 Match.  Additionally, Col Allan Bacon once asked me why I was handicapping myself at 25.  At the time I was shooting Star hollow points at 25 and I didn't consider I was, but any accuracy gain is a plus.  Another point is that every time I get my blood lead level checked, New York State Department of Health calls me up and tells me what it is before my doctor does.  Another remembered point is that I don't have to change the seating die adjustment, only the powder drop.  There might be more reasons, like, I think at the time I started using JHP for both, the price wasn't actually too different.  I can't recall the other reasons, if there were any.  It was a little while ago when I started down this path.  I do shoot lead for 50 ft Indoor Matches and training.

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Re: How light it too light?

Post by 1joel1 on 3/8/2018, 7:24 pm

I used to shoot 3.4gr of Bullseye at 25 yards. 

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Re: How light it too light?

Post by rreid on 3/8/2018, 8:45 pm

4.4gr WST and a Zero 185 jhp recoils very softly and still groups under 2.5" at 50 yards from my EIC gun.
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Re: How light it too light?

Post by troystaten on 3/8/2018, 9:29 pm

You might also try coated bullets for the 25 yard line, I load Bayou bullets 185 grain lead wadcutters.  With 3.8 grains of Bullseye they are more than accurate enough and shoot very cleanly.

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Re: How light it too light?

Post by Toz35m on 3/8/2018, 11:14 pm

If one was to shoot about 4000/yr you only save about $130 shooting Zero LSWCHP vs Zero JHP.
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Re: How light it too light?

Post by USSR on 3/9/2018, 6:11 am

I cast my own for about $0.03 per bullet.   Some serious savings there.

Don
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Re: How light it too light?

Post by 10sandxs on 3/9/2018, 7:14 am

Cast and coat. Then shoot 45s for close to the price of 22's. When your bullet and primer are about the same price life is good!

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Re: How light it too light?

Post by BE Mike on 3/9/2018, 7:20 am

Ed Hall wrote:
BE Mike wrote:My question is, Why use those expensive bullets at the short line?
I used to shoot jacketed at 50 and lead at 25, but I had to clean my gun at lunch so I didn't run copper over lead in the .45 Match.  Additionally, Col Allan Bacon once asked me why I was handicapping myself at 25.  At the time I was shooting Star hollow points at 25 and I didn't consider I was, but any accuracy gain is a plus.  Another point is that every time I get my blood lead level checked, New York State Department of Health calls me up and tells me what it is before my doctor does.  Another remembered point is that I don't have to change the seating die adjustment, only the powder drop.  There might be more reasons, like, I think at the time I started using JHP for both, the price wasn't actually too different.  I can't recall the other reasons, if there were any.  It was a little while ago when I started down this path.  I do shoot lead for 50 ft Indoor Matches and training.
I understand the reason for EIC; it's the rule now. Back when I was shooting pretty good slow fire scores, I used to use Noslers at the long line and Star 185 gr. swaged LSWCHP at the short line. I never cleaned the barrel or even ran a patch through it during matches. I remember shooting some very decent scores at the long line in centerfire, sometimes a 97, 98 or 99 (rarely). I never actually checked the effect accuracy of Noslers with the machine rest after lead bullets, but I never felt handicapped. I suspect that different barrels might have different results. I can see how handling lead bullets when reloading and especially if shooting indoors, might be a concern if one tends to have high lead levels, but there again, I think that different folks react differently to lead exposure. I can see where one might not want to fiddle with changing the seating adjustment. Of course some folks have deep pockets and the cost isn't a concern, I suppose. I never could relate to that. Crying or Very sad
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Re: How light it too light?

Post by Bullseye_Stan on 3/9/2018, 11:42 am

I arrived at my 45 short line load by getting the lightest load that would cycle reliably.  I loaded up 15 round batches with the same bullet, crimp, and length but with each batch having a 0.1 grain variation in powder then went to the range.  When the lowest charge wouldn't cycle the slide, I went to the lightest recoil spring I had.  When that wouldn't cycle reliably, I went up 0.1 gr of Bullseye.  

I later dropped my recoil spring a pound.  For a while I needed to clean and polish the chamber for no alibi's.  Then I got a rifle 0.50 bronze bore brush and bent it to clean the chamber.  A chamber cleaning after 50 rounds stopped the alibi's (which were failure to chamber).  All that was for 200 gr LSWC bullets. I now shoot 185 gr lead button nose with 3.3 gr BE powder, same crimp and same bullet shoulder depth.  I've got some Zero 185gr JHP to try and will go through a similar approach with them - I'm waiting for nicer weather.

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Re: How light it too light?

Post by Dockokol on 3/12/2018, 9:41 am

Thanks all.  I appreciate the help.  I loaded up a variety and found 4.0 works best for me.  Just fyi, 3.8 cycled fine, but it just seemed too "mushy" for me.

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