Laser cartridge for dry fire

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Post by tvphotog on 12/6/2018, 8:45 pm

I've been using Laser Ammo 9mm cartridges for years with great accuracy and longevity. However, my 1911 .45 firing pin pounds the cartridge cap so hard that it breaks after 30 or so activations. Cheapshot products are not accurate and I've returned them, and LaserLyte reviews say just what I've experienced with Laser Ammo in my1911. Has anyone used a laser cartridge successfully in a .45 1911?

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Post by joem5636 on 12/7/2018, 7:14 am

Replace the firing pin spring for dry firing? Perhaps a bit of flattening of a spare firing pin tip if changing the spring changes the feel?

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Post by tvphotog on 12/7/2018, 9:12 am

joem5636 wrote:Replace the firing pin spring for dry firing? Perhaps a bit of flattening of a spare firing pin tip if changing the spring changes the feel?
Thanks, Joe, a bit of a hassle each time I want to dry fire and then take it to the range the next day. I guess JMB didn't think of dry firing when he designed the world's best handgun.

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Post by SteveT on 12/7/2018, 9:38 am

Can you file a little bit off the front of the laser cartridge so it sits a little further forward?
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Post by Oleg G on 12/7/2018, 5:38 pm

I have the Laserlyte cartridge and have used it for dry fire training with no ill effects. Probably nihave about 1000 clicks on it.
I also have their .22 cartridge, which inserts into the barrel and works by detecting the sound of the hammer. Works well with my Ruger, AA conversion and AW93.
Laserlyte makes a universal cartridge that works for the large pistol calibers and inserts into the barrel. Try it - perhaps it will work for you.

https://www.amazon.com/LaserLyte-Universal-Activated-Training-simulating/dp/B010FMFRLO/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1544225694&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=laserlyte+laser+trainer+universal&psc=1
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Post by robvasi on 3/17/2019, 11:32 am

No doubt I am misunderstanding the laser cartridge.  The laser cartridge replaces the live round, and when the trigger is squeezed, the cartridge fires a laser beam at the target.  So far, so good, but how do you know where it hit?  With the focus on the sights and since the laser dot in visible for a fraction of a second, I don't see how you can see where it hit?

Has anyone used a laser target system?

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Post by Oleg G on 3/17/2019, 11:49 am

You use the laser cartridge in conjunction with a camera-based targeting system, like this one, for example:

https://lasrapp.com/store/software

LASR app has a targets add-on, which includes B-16 Bullseye target.

I have used LASR software and it is a decent aid to liven up dry fire. Over time I abandoned the use of this software in favor of MantisX and eventually SCATT. Now I train a lot on the blank wall and with SCATT.

Another system based on the laser cartridge, is iTarget. I have not used this one, so cannot comment on it.

https://www.itargetpro.com/
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Post by robvasi on 3/18/2019, 3:25 am

impressive. 

I am considering this one:

https://www.laserhit.com/products/trainingkit-mini

Thank you for this information

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Post by Allgoodhits on 3/18/2019, 9:12 am

My .02

The laser cartridges are most useful if a recording camera captures the moment of "fire" This then tells a truer picture of that which has already occurred. Dry firing, like live reveal something different on the target, than that which we called. Sometimes we er, sometimes we are in denial.

Laser grips, like CTC, are good in that they are a continuous beam. They tell you what is going during the firing process, as well as what happened at the time of fire. Again when used with camera, playing back can reveal some things you may not have been aware of. The CTC's are excellent for developing a better DA grip, trigger finger placement in my opinion. They reveal a lot about what is going on during that long trigger stroke, leading up to hammer fall.

Perhaps, having both may be ideal. The CTC, or continuous beam for training, the pulse beam for measuring the result of the training. Both have merit, neither the end all. Of course draw back to CTC is that you may not use a "grip" (handle) that is the same as what CTC offers.
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Post by robvasi on 3/19/2019, 8:17 am

Allgoodhits wrote:My .02

The laser cartridges are most useful if a recording camera captures the moment of "fire" This then tells a truer picture of that which has already occurred. Dry firing, like live reveal something different on the target, than that which we called. Sometimes we er, sometimes we are in denial.

Laser grips, like CTC, are good in that they are a continuous beam. They tell you what is going during the firing process, as well as what happened at the time of fire. Again when used with camera, playing back can reveal some things you may not have been aware of. The CTC's are excellent for developing a better DA grip, trigger finger placement in my opinion. They reveal a lot about what is going on during that long trigger stroke, leading up to hammer fall.

Perhaps, having both may be ideal. The CTC, or continuous beam for training, the pulse beam for measuring the result of the training. Both have merit, neither the end all. Of course draw back to CTC is that you may not use a "grip" (handle) that is the same as what CTC offers.  

I am looking at some options.  Could a laser training device be used for sight alignment?

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Post by WillH on 3/19/2019, 8:46 am

I have been using the Cool Fire trainer with my 1911 recently.  This is a system where CO2 is used to cycle the action (of actual 1911) and a laser beam is also emitted at point of fire. This offers some advantages: (a) the trigger is automatically re-set after each shot, (b) provides a format to practice sustained fire, (c) recoil is simulated fairly well, and (d) the laser can be sighted in to the pistol with adjustments.  The downside of the system is that the laser target it came with isn't very useful for BE purposes. However, the cycling of the slide was what I was really after.  I am now thinking of pairing this system to the Laserammo LaserPET since the small size of the black area target cards can be made to approximate appearance of real targets.  Interested if anyone else has tried that combination.  Some links provided below to items I mentioned. 

https://coolfiretrainer.com/
http://store.laser-ammo.com/electronic-targets/laserpet-ii.html

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Post by Allgoodhits on 3/19/2019, 2:35 pm

robvasi wrote:
Allgoodhits wrote:My .02

The laser cartridges are most useful if a recording camera captures the moment of "fire" This then tells a truer picture of that which has already occurred. Dry firing, like live reveal something different on the target, than that which we called. Sometimes we er, sometimes we are in denial.

Laser grips, like CTC, are good in that they are a continuous beam. They tell you what is going during the firing process, as well as what happened at the time of fire. Again when used with camera, playing back can reveal some things you may not have been aware of. The CTC's are excellent for developing a better DA grip, trigger finger placement in my opinion. They reveal a lot about what is going on during that long trigger stroke, leading up to hammer fall.

Perhaps, having both may be ideal. The CTC, or continuous beam for training, the pulse beam for measuring the result of the training. Both have merit, neither the end all. Of course draw back to CTC is that you may not use a "grip" (handle) that is the same as what CTC offers.  

I am looking at some options.  Could a laser training device be used for sight alignment?

Not sure I understand exactly what you are asking.

A laser bore sighting type device can aid in getting sights or a scope on paper, but no substitute for actual zeroing with the intended ammo at the intended distance. The guide rod type laser sighters would be next best, and the CTC type laser pointers would be the least accurate for purposes of aligning sights or scope to laser or vice versa.

The bore laser has no means to forecast bullet drop. The laser does not drop. The guide rod laser adds perceived climb as well as drop, i.e. trajectory. The grip type off center laser has to deal with up and down and a lateral. In other words the laser or bullet gets to point they intersect, then they cross. This is similar to a trajectory thing, except it also adds a left right mix to the error, as distance increases. With any of the lasers, IMO, it is best to sight them at the greatest distance they likely will be used. They will be off a little at closer ranges and at slightly further distances. However, if you sight the grip type offset lasers in real close, they are way off at distance.
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Post by lyman1903 on 3/19/2019, 3:32 pm

tvphotog wrote:

 I guess JMB didn't think of dry firing when he designed the world's best handgun.
betting he did, 

he surely had no idea what a laser sighting system was,
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Post by robvasi on 3/19/2019, 3:40 pm

Allgoodhits wrote:
robvasi wrote:
Allgoodhits wrote:My .02

The laser cartridges are most useful if a recording camera captures the moment of "fire" This then tells a truer picture of that which has already occurred. Dry firing, like live reveal something different on the target, than that which we called. Sometimes we er, sometimes we are in denial.

Laser grips, like CTC, are good in that they are a continuous beam. They tell you what is going during the firing process, as well as what happened at the time of fire. Again when used with camera, playing back can reveal some things you may not have been aware of. The CTC's are excellent for developing a better DA grip, trigger finger placement in my opinion. They reveal a lot about what is going on during that long trigger stroke, leading up to hammer fall.

Perhaps, having both may be ideal. The CTC, or continuous beam for training, the pulse beam for measuring the result of the training. Both have merit, neither the end all. Of course draw back to CTC is that you may not use a "grip" (handle) that is the same as what CTC offers.  

I am looking at some options.  Could a laser training device be used for sight alignment?

Not sure I understand exactly what you are asking.

A laser bore sighting type device can aid in getting sights or a scope on paper, but no substitute for actual zeroing with the intended ammo at the intended distance. The guide rod type laser sighters would be next best, and the CTC type laser pointers would be the least accurate for purposes of aligning sights or scope to laser or vice versa.

The bore laser has no means to forecast bullet drop. The laser does not drop. The guide rod laser adds perceived climb as well as drop, i.e. trajectory. The grip type off center laser has to deal with up and down and a lateral. In other words the laser or bullet gets to point they intersect, then they cross. This is similar to a trajectory thing, except it also adds a left right mix to the error, as distance increases. With any of the lasers, IMO, it is best to sight them at the greatest distance they likely will be used. They will be off a little at closer ranges and at slightly further distances. However, if you sight the grip type offset lasers in real close, they are way off at distance.
What I want is a method of getting the sights set,  I am not asking about laser grips, just the open sights. Since the laser is straight and the bullet has a trajectory, the sights will be set for a line not a trajectory.  Even so, is this a reasonable place to set the sight?

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Post by Allgoodhits on 3/19/2019, 7:28 pm

Getting the sights set is a continuum IMO. Fine tuning depends on where the sun is, how dark it is where the target is and how dark it is where you are. Additionally, some days you pull the trigger different than you do other days.

It given the opportunity to sight in, do so. If you are shooting a good group, then adjust the sights to move the group where you want it to be. Often a minor foot adjustment will do the same thing. This is just something you will need to learn for yourself. Put another way. If the gun wants to settle to left or right, or high or low, then that may be a position correction. Foot placement likely will correct this. If the gun settles in the center yet groups are not, then that is likely a sight adjustment. If most shots are where you want them, yet some are not, that is likely a trigger error unless you call the shot off when it broke.

Shooting is actually pretty simple, it just isn't easy for most of us. IMO, we make it more complex than it needs to be. That also makes it even harder.
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