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6 o'clock hold for irons and red dot?

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dronning
CR10X
Ray Dash
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6 o'clock hold for irons and red dot? Empty 6 o'clock hold for irons and red dot?

Post by Ray Dash Thu Mar 21, 2019 10:17 pm

I took my dot off and moved to irons and I am noticing that my groups are actually getting better with the iron sights using a 6 o'clock hold or even a slightly sub six. My theory is that when using a red dot I am just to focused on looking at the dot since it is covering the black and pulling the trigger when the dot looks perfectly centered. I know that I am supposed to be focused on the target and just concentrating on the trigger but it seems like my brain just goes right to the dot. 

I am curious if anyone has tried a 6 o'clock hold with the red dot so that even though the dot will be on the target it will be out of the black and possibly let me concentrate on the black and not the dot if that makes any sense?
Ray Dash
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Post by CR10X Fri Mar 22, 2019 6:50 am

(1)  Some people do better focusing on the dot, others on the target when using a dot scope.
(2)  Some people do better when using 6:00 hold, some with sub - 6 hold with open sights (most), some with center hold.
(3)  I've never heard of anyone using sub-six for dot, I have heard of some people using the lower portion of the black.
(4)  No one that I've heard of does better looking at target with open sights.

So for consistency, I focus on the dot and use sub-six for open since focusing on the dot / front sight since it feels more natural for me.  Therefore I'm always focusing on something similar, I can see the wobble pattern better and the aiming area is in the background. 

YMMV, so try out the good options and make good notes in your journal.  The answer will become clear; however preferences may change as you shoot more.  When you reach a plateau, go back to checking previous preferences and assumptions.

CR


Last edited by CR10X on Fri Mar 22, 2019 2:13 pm; edited 1 time in total

CR10X

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Post by Ray Dash Fri Mar 22, 2019 7:32 am

This is where my confusion is....
With irons I know that I have to focus on the front sight but with a dot I thought the correct way was to focus on the target? I personally see the dot and the target on the same focal plane so it is impossible to focus on one or the other. Because of this I feel I chase the dot around. My thought was if I hold the dot below the black that I would pay more attention to the black and kinda of tune out the dot.
Ray Dash
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Post by dronning Fri Mar 22, 2019 8:05 am

Ray Dash wrote: I personally see the dot and the target on the same focal plane so it is impossible to focus on one or the other. Because of this I feel I chase the dot around. My thought was if I hold the dot below the black that I would pay more attention to the black and kinda of tune out the dot.
Try turning your dot up or down there will be a sweet spot for you.  When I was focusing on the dot I had it set brighter.  When I switched to focusing on the target I set it lower - but not too low or I'd start to look for the dot.
- Dave
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Post by james r chapman Fri Mar 22, 2019 9:14 am

Many focus on dot,
Many focus on target,
Many are High Masters,
Many are National Champions.

I just don’t see where you can put the dot but centered in the bull
james r chapman
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Post by CR10X Fri Mar 22, 2019 9:36 am

The dot and target are close to the same focal distance for most dot scopes, but not exactly. If they appear the same, check your focus or check your eyeglass prescription.

If you "tune out" the dot, how do you determine if the wobble area is getting smaller and centered, which indicates the gun is in a consistently parallel position with the desired aiming area? I assume you mean it's part of the picture, but not your focus point. If that is what you meant, then it is consistent with the focus on the target method. But, I think having the dot over the black will give you a better reference / visual picture.
CR


Last edited by CR10X on Fri Mar 22, 2019 10:24 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by weber1b Fri Mar 22, 2019 10:05 am

I used to shoot sub six with open sights but mentally felt like I would prefer to shoot center hold. I got glasses made for open sight shooting that sets the focal point on the front sight. It did two things for me. Because of how the focal point was set, the target bull is a blur and there is nothing I can do about that so it is much easier to keep my focus on the front sight. It also allowed me to discern the sights from the bull so I can shoot open sights at center and still see the sights. Doesn't work as well indoors, but I don't generally shoot open sights indoors anyway so not a problem.

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Post by CFPlinker Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:53 am

A couple of years ago I tried using a "super 6" hold with the dot. In other words my aiming  point is just inside the black at 6:00. After a little practice I noticed that my wobble was much less. After making the appropriate sight adjustments my scores improved and that is the hold I still use. YMMV but try it and see if you like it.

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Post by bruce martindale Fri Mar 22, 2019 1:19 pm

I found l could hold tighter on a smaller target at 50 yards, but using the 25s there or putting a sticker there isn't allowed. I was training with 50 foot bulls at 25 yards with good effect but it didn't translate to proper 25s. 

 Next best thing : l like the "Cherry in the Bowl" sight picture because it gives me a smaller spot to hold. Big target areas fool me into accepting a less than optimum hold.

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