.45ACP Ammo for CMP Matches

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Post by KB2MBC on Wed Jul 10, 2019 1:27 pm

Is it legal to shoot 185gr FMJ semi-wadcutter in any of the CMP Matches?

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Post by Wobbley on Wed Jul 10, 2019 1:31 pm

I’d email the CMP and ask, but I think so. The SWC prohibition is aimed at lead (and perhaps plated) bullets, I believe.
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Post by KB2MBC on Wed Jul 10, 2019 1:46 pm

Yeah, I shouldn’t have been so lazy not looking it up.
As long as it’s FMJ, I’m good to go.
Poo-poo on lead.
Thanks for the response.

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Post by james r chapman on Wed Jul 10, 2019 2:25 pm

See federal gm45 ammo
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Post by Ed Hall on Wed Jul 10, 2019 3:21 pm

KB2MBC wrote:Yeah, I shouldn’t have been so lazy not looking it up.
As long as it’s FMJ, I’m good to go.
Poo-poo on lead.
Thanks for the response.
Not FMJ, just J.  Hollow point are acceptable:

4.3 Ammunition
4.3.1 Pistol Ammunition
a) Service Pistol. Service Pistol competitors may use any safe ammunition
that is loaded with metal-jacketed or metal-plated bullets. Non-jacketed,
wad-cutter or lead bullets may not be used.

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Post by Allgoodhits on Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:04 pm

Ed Hall wrote:
KB2MBC wrote:Yeah, I shouldn’t have been so lazy not looking it up.
As long as it’s FMJ, I’m good to go.
Poo-poo on lead.
Thanks for the response.
Not FMJ, just J.  Hollow point are acceptable:

4.3 Ammunition
4.3.1 Pistol Ammunition
a) Service Pistol. Service Pistol competitors may use any safe ammunition
that is loaded with metal-jacketed or metal-plated bullets. Non-jacketed,
wad-cutter or lead bullets may not be used.

I am glad you brought this up, as it has come up in an EIC match where a guy I was scoring shot 185 JHP on the long line, but when I scored his first target on the short line the holes were WC holes. I questioned it, and he simply stated that the rules say you can use WC if they are jacketed. Back at the bench he showed me that he was using Factory Federal WC.

I think the last sentence under 4.3.1 (a) means. Non-jacketed [or] wad-cutter [or] lead bullets may not be used.

I believe his and other interpretations are that non-jacketed wad-cutters are not allowed, but jacketed wad-cutters are allowed.

What is CMP scoop on this? Do CMP EIC rules differ from NRA service pistol when it comes to ammo or bullets?
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Post by Ed Hall on Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:23 pm

I think the "any safe ammunition that is loaded with metal-jacketed or metal-plated bullets" includes FMJ semi-wad-cutters.

Do note that wad-cutters and semi-wad-cutters are different.  If he was using the Factory Federal 185gn Match ammo, that is a semi-wad-cutter bullet.  I've used them since the ammo change with no questions ever raised.

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Post by cdrt on Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:02 pm

Before the latest rule on what calibers can be used in the 1911, the restriction on wadcutters was meant to keep competitors from using a 1911 in .38 Special.  They changed the rule from bore diamteters to specific calibers for the 1911 in this year's rule book, but left the wadcutter restriction.  Semi-wadcuters have been allowed since they expanded the number of legal Service Pistols.
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Post by KB2MBC on Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:18 am

Ed Hall wrote:“If he was using the Factory Federal 185gn Match ammo, that is a semi-wad-cutter bullet.”
That I is. I brought ammo for 100 and NTI but forgot about Service Pistol, so I bought the Fed Match ammo.

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Post by adminbot1911 on Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:09 am

Semi-wadcutter is not wadcutter, like semi-automatic is not automatic.  Semi-wadcutter is legal, wadcutter (of any composition and coating) is not.

Jacketed semi-wadcutter is standard issue at Navy matches.  In 200 grain flavor if memory serves right.

The rulebook should include the Oxford comma after "wadcutter" to alleviate the meaning of "or" confusion.
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Post by Allgoodhits on Thu Jul 11, 2019 2:53 pm

adminbot1911 wrote:Semi-wadcutter is not wadcutter, like semi-automatic is not automatic.  Semi-wadcutter is legal, wadcutter (of any composition and coating) is not.

Jacketed semi-wadcutter is standard issue at Navy matches.  In 200 grain flavor if memory serves right.

The rulebook should include the Oxford comma after "wadcutter" to alleviate the meaning of "or" confusion.

Exactly.

So under this position a BNWC or button nose wadcutter is not a "full" wadcutter either. Is a HBWC or WCHB a full wadcutter? What is a full wadcutter. Is a full wadcutter only a DEWC? It really isn't that difficult to write rules and regs to make them simpler, clearer and fairly precise. Oh well. Got to love the NRA and CMP.
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Post by Dr.Don on Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:25 pm

A full wadcutter has a full diameter squared off front end.  You could use it in a press to "cut wads".
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Post by fc60 on Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:29 pm

Greetings,

This really makes me miss the days where you were issued 30 rounds of 45 ACP hardball....

So relieved I earned my badge before all the changes.

Cheers,

Dave
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Post by cdrt on Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:51 pm

fc60 wrote:Greetings,

This really makes me miss the days where you were issued 30 rounds of 45 ACP hardball....
So relieved I earned my badge before all the changes.
Cheers,
Dave
.45ACP Ammo for CMP Matches 3064385617
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Post by jglenn21 on Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:58 pm

+2  used to be some extra ammo around too... still have some white boxes from the late 70s
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Post by Allgoodhits on Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:33 pm

fc60 wrote:Greetings,

This really makes me miss the days where you were issued 30 rounds of 45 ACP hardball....

So relieved I earned my badge before all the changes.

Cheers,

Dave

B I N G O
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Post by Dr.Don on Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:38 pm

Same here Dave.
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Post by john bickar on Fri Jul 12, 2019 1:34 am

fc60 wrote:Greetings,

This really makes me miss the days where you were issued 30 rounds of 45 ACP hardball....

So relieved I earned my badge before all the changes.

Cheers,

Dave

Times have changed.

On Sunday afternoon at Canton, I simply was glad that I had earned my badge WELL before the rain came pouring down again.

I don't care what projectile or caliber those shooters who stood out in the rain and shot were using. Every shooter out there  earned whatever leg points they got.

I wasn't about to stand out in that shit again.

"The joy is in the struggle", and every one of them got a lot of joy.
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Post by James Hensler on Sun Jul 14, 2019 9:21 pm

Amen
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