GSP .32 questions

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Post by lablover on 1/8/2020, 6:17 pm

GSP expert .32 Smith & Wesson long wadcutter

Is she a capable contender and 50 yards?  Seems reloading can be a challenge as well especially with a Dillon 650.

Obviously only wad cutter Bullets.  Those shooting this any load recommendations? Brass , powder etc.

In the research stage .  Not interested in buying new barrels for a new gun.  marksman right now so keep that in mind.  Shot one the other day and really enjoyed it

Edit:  earls dot rail or champions choice rail?  Not sure what or if there is any difference 

Thanks all


Last edited by lablover on 1/8/2020, 7:05 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by NuJudge on 1/8/2020, 6:45 pm

I shoot a GSP better with the .32 upper, than I do with the .22 upper.  

I have not shot mine at 50 yards yet, but the groups are excellent at 25.  When I get better than Marksman, I will try 50 yards.  The hand loading techniques on a XL650 are really odd to me, having loaded mostly hard round nose or SemiWadCutter bullets in the past.  I re-swage Speer HBWC bullets to .3145".  I have a custom Lee size die much larger ID than normal, so as not to swage the case down as much.  I have to lube the INSIDE of a new case, or the expand die will rip the rim off the case.  I have a PhotoEscape expander/powder drop die that expands the case such that the bullet is pushed in almost all the way with finger pressure.  Many types of .32 brass are not suitable, because the case web thickens too much, too near the case mouth.  

I have been using 1.7 grains of Bullseye powder with the Speer HBWC bullet.  Lapua brass works for me, as does S&B, but on S&B I get slight bulges from the case web thickening.  One lot of Remington primers have been piercing on me, but it's just the one lot.  

Use lots of task lighting and LOOK in each case to see if you have enough powder, and not too much.  I had an episode of powder bridging in the measure.  Stop the press regularly, for no reason, and measure powder charges.  A double charge or a squib that you do not notice will ruin your day.  

Posts by FC60 here are excellent.

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Post by fc60 on 1/8/2020, 7:05 pm

Greetings,

There are two GSP-C models. The Classic one and the newer Expert model.

Both barrels of recent manufacture have groove dimensions of 0.3135"-0.315".

As there are no quality HBWC bullets available, a cast bullet matched to the groove diameter might be your best choice.

With cast bullets, you would want to seek out brass designed for wadcutter bullets. Some choices are Lapua, Remington, Fiocchi, and, possibly, Magtech. Again, they must have been loaded with wadcutter bullets originally. Remington is an exception.

I had good results using 1.65 grains of Winchester WST powder with Lapua cases. Small primer of your choice.

Lee Precision will sell you a sizing die that does not over work the brass during sizing. I suggest getting a die that sizes the case 0.001" smaller than a loaded round with the bullet of choice.

The factory barrels can shoot ten-ring at 50 yards with carefully loaded ammo.

There are other tricks to try; but, for now I feel I have offered enough information to keep you out of mischief.

Cheers,

Dave
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Post by lablover on 1/8/2020, 7:08 pm

NuJudge wrote:I shoot a GSP better with the .32 upper, than I do with the .22 upper.  

I have not shot mine at 50 yards yet, but the groups are excellent at 25.  When I get better than Marksman, I will try 50 yards.  The hand loading techniques on a XL650 are really odd to me, having loaded mostly hard round nose or SemiWadCutter bullets in the past.  I re-swage Speer HBWC bullets to .3145".  I have a custom Lee size die much larger ID than normal, so as not to swage the case down as much.  I have to lube the INSIDE of a new case, or the expand die will rip the rim off the case.  I have a PhotoEscape expander/powder drop die that expands the case such that the bullet is pushed in almost all the way with finger pressure.  Many types of .32 brass are not suitable, because the case web thickens too much, too near the case mouth.  

I have been using 1.7 grains of Bullseye powder with the Speer HBWC bullet.  Lapua brass works for me, as does S&B, but on S&B I get slight bulges from the case web thickening.  One lot of Remington primers have been piercing on me, but it's just the one lot.  

Use lots of task lighting and LOOK in each case to see if you have enough powder, and not too much.  I had an episode of powder bridging in the measure.  Stop the press regularly, for no reason, and measure powder charges.  A double charge or a squib that you do not notice will ruin your day.  

Posts by FC60 here are excellent.
And a fellow Michigander!  Excellent 

Good info.  Tearing up the search function to see what I can find
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Post by lablover on 1/8/2020, 7:13 pm

fc60 wrote:Greetings,

There are two GSP-C models. The Classic one and the newer Expert model.

Both barrels of recent manufacture have groove dimensions of 0.3135"-0.315".

As there are no quality HBWC bullets available, a cast bullet matched to the groove diameter might be your best choice.

With cast bullets, you would want to seek out brass designed for wadcutter bullets. Some choices are Lapua, Remington, Fiocchi, and, possibly, Magtech. Again, they must have been loaded with wadcutter bullets originally. Remington is an exception.

I had good results using 1.65 grains of Winchester WST powder with Lapua cases. Small primer of your choice.

Lee Precision will sell you a sizing die that does not over work the brass during sizing. I suggest getting a die that sizes the case 0.001" smaller than a loaded round with the bullet of choice.

The factory barrels can shoot ten-ring at 50 yards with carefully loaded ammo.

There are other tricks to try; but, for now I feel I have offered enough information to keep you out of mischief.

Cheers,

Dave
The master has spoken!  Outstanding!!!

I figure I might start with some factory Ammo to keep things safe and easy to break it in.

The .32 from Earl on this page is what I’m looking at. 

http://www.carlwalther.com/gsp.htm

 I’m assuming it’s not the classic but the newer expert.

Any favorite factory loads?  Also will use brass from my break in factory loads to reload as well


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Post by radjag on 1/8/2020, 7:25 pm

I used an older GSP for several months in 2019. Rink grip and Earl's scope mount with a 1" UD. Fiocchi factory ammo. Very smooth and reliable. Very accurate at 25yds, but a lot of bullet tumbling evident at 50yds which is not conducive to good scores!
There are many threads on this forum about 32SWL bullets, do some searching. My conclusion was to buy "bumped" plinkers from Zane Moseley, but I've not had chance to test them at 50yds myself cause I switched to a 32ACP Pardini (which presents a whole different and even more complicated lot of ammo issues!).

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Post by gregbenner on 1/9/2020, 12:38 am

If Zane is still selling bumped swaged Speer Bullets I think you will have noticeably better accuracy at 50 yards than with anything else readily available.  Photo Escape sells a super powder thru dies for the 550, not sure about 650. Perhaps call Lee at UniqueTek ( they specialize in Dillon precision loading stuff). Definitely follow Dave’s and Lablovers advice per above. Using a Ransom Rest I have achieved 10 ring results as well in my GSP.

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Post by lablover on 1/9/2020, 6:25 am

Any difference between champions choice or earls scope base?  They look the same just cost difference.

I have the word out to Zane
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Post by bruce martindale on 1/9/2020, 8:55 am

Having worked with Dave and others, l too have beaten the 32 monster and got a factory gun performing well at 50 yards. The factory bbl is both oversized and too slow in twist. Imagine that, from German engineering to boot.

Anyways, you need the right bullet diameter, advanced loading technique, and elevated speed to overcome their carelessness ( speed is gained from use WST). Factory ammo is poor, across the board due to low speed etc. FYI Dave has a fast twist, right sized bbl.

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Post by fc60 on 1/9/2020, 10:45 am

Greetings,

You are looking at the Expert model.

Fortunately, replacement barrels are not difficult to machine.

A custom barrel will enable the use of Speer 98 grain HBWC "Plinkers".

Cheers,

Dave
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Post by Fezzik68 on 1/9/2020, 1:22 pm

I would be interested in a high twist barrel myself. Just became an owner of an older GSP-C a few months ago. Loads are good at 25 yds, haven't tried 50yds yet. Working up loads with the chrono.
I am having some tight chambering issues, though.

Shooting leagues with the GSP .22 and couldn't be happier.

-Jim

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Post by zanemoseley on 1/9/2020, 2:22 pm

lablover wrote:Any difference between champions choice or earls scope base?  They look the same just cost difference.

I have the word out to Zane

I PM'ed you a novel this morning regarding my 32 experiences so far. Let me know if you have any questions.

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Post by lablover on 1/9/2020, 2:33 pm

zanemoseley wrote:
lablover wrote:Any difference between champions choice or earls scope base?  They look the same just cost difference.

I have the word out to Zane

I PM'ed you a novel this morning regarding my 32 experiences so far. Let me know if you have any questions.
Got it and thank you
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Post by fc60 on 1/9/2020, 2:42 pm

Fezzik68 wrote:I would be interested in a high twist barrel myself. Just became an owner of an older GSP-C a few months ago. Loads are good at 25 yds, haven't tried 50yds yet. Working up loads with the chrono.
I am having some tight chambering issues, though.

Shooting leagues with the GSP .22 and couldn't be happier.

-Jim
Greetings Jim,

More information needed.

What type of bullet and diameter are you using?

What brand of brass?

Tight chambering has me puzzled as Walther chambers are rather "generous".

Cheers,

Dave
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Post by lablover on 1/9/2020, 2:50 pm

So is a factory barrel impossible to be made to shoot at 50 yards?
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Post by Fezzik68 on 1/9/2020, 5:53 pm

Hi Dave,

I have some Missouri 98gr DEWC - measures .313, and some Magnus WCBB - measures .314. Cases say G.F.L. came with the gun when I bought it. Also have some new Starline. I run the reloads through a Lee carbide factory crimp/sizing die on the last station of my 550.

Once the first round goes off it cycles fine, first round chambers snug.

I appreciate any advice you are willing to share.

-Jim

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Post by bruce martindale on 1/9/2020, 6:37 pm

lablover wrote:So is a factory barrel impossible to be made to shoot at 50 yards?
They shoot just fine, see my post above please.

To "tight chambering" , is that bcause you have a bulge in the case, at the base of the bullet?

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Post by lablover on 1/9/2020, 6:53 pm

bruce martindale wrote:
lablover wrote:So is a factory barrel impossible to be made to shoot at 50 yards?
They shoot just fine, see my post above please.

To "tight chambering" , is that bcause you have a bulge in the case, at the base of the bullet?
Obviously I’m blind in one eye and can’t see out the other....haha haha

Thanks Bruce
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Post by JKR on 1/9/2020, 6:59 pm

With a Benelli, (same set of problems) I’ve had the best luck with unsized cases and the bumped up Speers. This is for long line loads.
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Post by fc60 on 1/9/2020, 7:19 pm

lablover wrote:So is a factory barrel impossible to be made to shoot at 50 yards?
Greetings Lablover,

Factory barrels from the Euro-guns will shoot just fine at 50 yards.

The "secret" is a proper fitting (0.314") HBWC and careful loading practice.

Sadly, 0.314" HBWC bullets are not to be found in the USA of any quality. The best were the German H&N; but, due to import/export laws they are no longer available in the USA nor Canada.

I have tested Pardini, MatchGun, and Benelli barrels at 50 yards via a barrel tester and record ten shot X-ring groups.

Rumor has it that MatchGuns will offer factory barrels close to 0.311" groove diameter which will allow the use of the Speer 98 HBWC "Plinkers" unaltered. I have yet to see one.

Cheers,

Dave
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Post by fc60 on 1/9/2020, 7:27 pm

Fezzik68 wrote:Hi Dave,

I have some Missouri 98gr DEWC - measures .313, and some Magnus WCBB - measures .314. Cases say G.F.L. came with the gun when I bought it. Also have some new Starline. I run the reloads through a Lee carbide factory crimp/sizing die on the last station of my 550.

Once the first round goes off it cycles fine, first round chambers snug.

I appreciate any advice you are willing to share.

-Jim
Greetings Jim,

Do not use the Lee Factory Carbide Crimp die to finish size cases after loading. It has the tendency to size the bullet smaller inside the case. The brass case will spring back leaving the bullet loose in the case near the bullet base.

Do the Fiocchi cases say "32 WADCUT"? If so, they should load fine. Some Fiocchi cases merely say 32 S&W Long and may have been loaded as service ammo where the cases are thicker in the midsection as compared with the ones marked "32 WADCUT"

Try sizing fired cases with the Lee Factory Carbide Die. They should measure about 0.336"-0.337". Then flare the case mouth and see how the cast bullets fit. If they start with some friction you are good to go.

At the last station, apply a taper crimp just so the flare is removed and you have positive functioning.

Walther chambers I have measured are 0.338" at the start of the Leade and 0.341" near the extractor groove.

Cheers,

Dave
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Post by gregbenner on 1/9/2020, 7:43 pm

Lablover, this thread might help. Zane is/was selling these, they work great. 

https://www.bullseyeforum.net/t9916-sw-32long-copying-the-hn-314-hbwc-for-reloading

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Post by lablover on 1/9/2020, 8:02 pm

gregbenner wrote:Lablover, this thread might help. Zane is/was selling these, they work great. 

https://www.bullseyeforum.net/t9916-sw-32long-copying-the-hn-314-hbwc-for-reloading
Thanks Greg

That’s a good read for sure.
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Post by lablover on 1/9/2020, 8:16 pm

Before I say this be advised I have not read every single post on the BE forum yet on this topic.

Why couldn’t a cast mold be made for the correct diameter bullet?  I’m assuming cast Bullets are not favored.

My Nephew own a machine shop and see no reason he could make dies, or whatever a  Be shooter could need for .32 I just don’t know enough about .32 yet to know what to ask for
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Post by radjag on 1/9/2020, 8:34 pm

Fezzik68

The brass marked GFI which I sent you is once fired (possibly twice, but I doubt it) factory Fiocchi 32SWL wadcutter. I bought my Fiocchi ammo in two batches from two separate sources, but all of it is wadcutter. I did start to reload some of it, but not much and I don't think that you have any of the reloaded brass.

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