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Sight picture on different pistols.

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Jack H
Jon Eulette
Mike38
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Sight picture on different pistols.  Empty Sight picture on different pistols.

Post by Mike38 4/17/2020, 12:28 am

I'm at a loss here, so I'm hoping someone can turn on a light bulb in my brain.

My primary .22 is a Benelli MP95. My back up pistol is a Ruger MkII. I train with the Ruger some to keep the mileage off the Benelli. Both have Rink grips, grip angle is close, using iron sights on both. Benelli has factory sights, the Ruger has a Millet rear sight (discontinued). I shoot the Benelli much better. Probably 5 to 10 points per NMC, which is a big difference as far as I'm concerned. I think the main difference is the sights. To get a good focus on the front sight of the Benelli, I use a +0.75 lens over my regular eye glasses. To get good focus on the front sight of the Ruger, I have to use a +1.0 lens over my regular eye glasses. I notice that I have a harder time keeping focus on the front sight of the Ruger. I've tried +0.75 with the Ruger, and that combination is horrible. The sights on the Ruger, overall, in every dimension are smaller than the Benelli sights. Width left edge to right edge, notch width, and front sight width are all smaller on the Ruger. Could this be the problem? Something I just have to live with? Or is there something I'm missing here?
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Post by Jon Eulette 4/17/2020, 1:15 am

Hmmmm. Are you getting similar groups from each pistol? Is Ruger grouping but your getting occasional flyers? How much daylight on Ruger vs Benelli? Is Ruger less?
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Post by Mike38 4/17/2020, 2:41 am

Jon Eulette wrote:Hmmmm. Are you getting similar groups from each pistol? Is Ruger grouping but your getting occasional flyers? How much daylight on Ruger vs Benelli? Is Ruger less?
Jon

What kills me on the Ruger is I loose focus on the front sight during sustained fire and throw out an 8 or at times even a 7. On slow fire the scores are very similar because if I loose focus on the front sight of the Ruger, I can abort the shot. The Ruger has less daylight on either side of the front sight. I did file the notch a bit wider. Do you think I should file a bit more? Maybe? I'd hate to ruin that Millet sight because it is no longer made.
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Post by Jack H 4/17/2020, 3:21 am

Put this on the Ruger.  Much better sight than the millet.

https://stores.kensight.com/ruger-mkii-or-mkiii-kensight-sight-beveled-blade/
If it is a bull barrel you might need this too. 
https://stores.kensight.com/ruger-mkii-or-mkiii-tall-undercut-patridge-front-sight/
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Post by DA/SA 4/17/2020, 6:10 am

Is there a difference in the distance from your eye to the front sight on the Ruger vs the Bennelli, or is the sight radius different?
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Post by CR10X 4/17/2020, 6:39 am

Sight finish, sight radius, front sight width, the sharpness of the edges (side and top) and notch width can affect our issues with maintaining proper visual focus on the front sight. 

For the Ruger, try some sight black as most of those are a little glossy and the  Benelli MP95 is probably a matt finish. Secondly, the Ruger front sight is probably more narrow than than the Benelli.  

For me the stock Ruger .22 sights requires additional attention to really focus on the front sight.  The notch depth was just not enough to get a lot of white on both sides to clearly see the lateral position of the sight in the notch.

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Post by Mike38 4/17/2020, 11:06 am

These replies are opening my eyes to some things, thanks so far. I took some measurements, and a picture if that helps.

Sight radius: Benelli 220mm - Ruger 210mm
Front sight width: Benelli 4mm - Ruger 3mm
Rear sight notch: Benelli 3.7mm - Ruger 3.2mm
Eye to front sight: close to same.

Pic of rear sights attached with Benelli on left.

I'm noticing the sight width and notch width are opposite. The Benelli notch is 0.3mm narrower than the front sight while the Ruger notch is 0.2mm wider than front sight. But, in a shooting stance, the Ruger appears to have less daylight on sides of front sight, which seems odd, but could be an optical illusion. Could this be my problem? 

I'm going to start with the simple stuff by blackening the Ruger sights as they do appear to be a bit more glossy. But please keep throwing suggestions my way. Thanks. Sight picture on different pistols.  4
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Post by CR10X 4/17/2020, 12:30 pm

Apparent front sight width is a factor of actual sight width, sight radius and a little bit of the notch width.  

When the rear notch gets too "tight" the bars of white on either side will begin to "glare out" (at least for me) and I can't judge the position of the front sight as well.  When the notch gets too wide, it becomes harder to judge when the front sight is exactly centered.  Its a balancing act.

Then we need to look at the front sight apparent width versus the width of the black.  Some people like equal to the width of the black.  Some people like the rear sight notch equal to the width of the black and a narrower front sight.  

Do a search over at Target Talk on sights and sight pictures in Olympic Pistol for a lot of information.

CR

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Post by Mike38 4/17/2020, 9:49 pm

Trained again with the Ruger tonight. Blackening the sights and better lighting seemed to help some. I'll figure this thing out in time.
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Post by SMBeyer 4/18/2020, 7:45 pm

For me, If the rear sight notch is too tight my eye cant get past the rear sight to focus on the front.  there are a lot of variables that affect this, you gotta find what works for you.  For a 8" sight radius (6" Smith revolver) 10 thousandths wider rear notch than front sight width seems ideal.
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Post by Lefty 5/21/2020, 12:45 am

I'm going to speculate that the difference is the width of the rear sight itself. On the Ruger you have a very small area of black around the notch, and that makes it harder to keep your focus on the front sight. In other words, you have light reaching your eye around the outside of the rear sight on the Ruger, which makes the rear sight harder to 'ignore'.

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