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Which Free Pistol

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Which Free Pistol Empty Which Free Pistol

Post by rkittine on Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:47 pm

I am looking to purchase another Free Pistol. A friend has a Hammerli / Walther FG 60, but I can't seem to find them anywhere. Were they replaced with the Walther FP500? If so, does anyone know of a dealer that might have or can order these?

My other Choice is a Morini CM83E Light with a 2 state trigger. These are available through TML Guns.

So which would you pick and why?

Thanks, Bob
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Post by Richard Ashmore on Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:02 pm

I would avoid the Hammerli due to lack of support.
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Post by rkittine on Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:06 pm

Isn't Walther the support now? What about the MatchGuns  or the Walther FP500? I wonder if that has replaced the FG 60 anyway.

Thanks, Bob
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Post by bruce martindale on Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:50 pm

Last l knew, There were only two to consider, the TOZ and the Morini CM84. 

The Morini felt heavy to me. I had used Hammerli 150, 152 electronic, 162 Special ( that's swiss for cheap, lots of plastic), and an early Morini model. I preferred the Russian gun.

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Post by mpolans on Wed Jul 01, 2020 3:26 pm

Hmm...a Toz-35 for about $400-500 (plus another $300 for a set of Rink grips) that is capable of shooting competent scores (IIRC, US record is still held by Bill Demarest who shot it with a loaner Toz), or anything else out there for double the price (and possibly also another $300 for a set of grips)...

If I was dead set on getting something other than a Toz, I would only consider mechanical trigger guns because of the concern that future lack of support would turn it into an expensive paperweight.  

This is a scenario that has already played out with Walther's defunct electronic trigger free pistols years ago and is a constant threat now with the electronic trigger Hammerlis and Morinis, especially now that Free Pistol has been dropped by the Olympics.  Now that it's no longer an Olympic event (though still a World Cup event), there probably won't be any future development and production on all free pistols has probably dropped precipitously.

FWIW, I've used a Hammerli 162.  Nice gun...when it worked.  About 15 years ago, UT-Austin team had several loaners, many of which seemed to have semi-frequent failures to fire.  Not sure if it was merely a maintenance issue or a design thing.  My Toz was always reliable.

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Post by rkittine on Wed Jul 01, 2020 3:53 pm

Thanks for the input. I already have a New Old Stock TOZ-35M. Rink is supposed to ship my grips on July 9th. I would like a second Free Pistol and now have included in the list the:
Morini Originally CM83E (Did not know there was a CM84E, which is what I am considering)
MatchGuns MG5
Pandini
Hammerli FG 60
Walther FP500

I was thinking that having my first electronic trigger may be interesting, until you said what you did about support. 

Bob


Last edited by rkittine on Wed Jul 01, 2020 5:07 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by bruce martindale on Wed Jul 01, 2020 4:52 pm

Try soldering 24 ga wire in an electronic, during a match. Steve's 152 during the ESG New York Olympics. 

I had no adjustment on mine at all.

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Post by rkittine on Wed Jul 01, 2020 5:05 pm

I have been a Ham Radio Operator since I was 10 and when I started out, you did a lot of your own soldering. At 71, the soldering would not be a problem, but seeing the no. 12 wire might be.

73 - WA2YDV
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Post by Richard Ashmore on Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:48 pm

rkittine wrote:Isn't Walther the support now? What about the MatchGuns  or the Walther FP500? I wonder if that has replaced the FG 60 anyway.

Thanks, Bob
The Walther seems to be a new design, and the Hammerli seems to be discontinued.
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Post by Sa-tevp on Wed Jul 01, 2020 7:35 pm

rkittine wrote:I have been a Ham Radio Operator since I was 10 and when I started out, you did a lot of your own soldering. At 71, the soldering would not be a problem, but seeing the no. 12 wire might be.

73 - WA2YDV

It may be some of the electrolytic capacitors in the old electronics boards have changed value over the years. Add that to electronics being coated after assembly and repairs sound, challenging.

I have a Steyr LP10E air pistol and if I did everything over again I would go mechanical.
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Post by Lefty on Wed Jul 01, 2020 10:27 pm

One thing that doesn't get mentioned often enough is that the TOZ trigger is not friendly if you have normal-to-short fingers, and/or if you're left-handed. I ended up having to get rid of mine; couldn't shoot the darn thing.

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Post by radjag on Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:28 am

Rkittine.

Red Feather Outfitters (Jim Henderson) displayed a lot of fine old stock guns from Larry's inventory yesterday after the match at Cardinal. There was at least one electronic trigger Hammerli free pistol for sale IIRC.

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Post by rkittine on Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:14 am

I have reached out to Jim. A relative of mine was the Sporting Clays manager at Cardinal Sports, so I know the facility well. He did get me a magazine for my P240 in .32 WC and is looking for a few for my Benelli MP3s. 

Although I am left handed, I now shoot right handed do to eye issues, so we will just have to see with the TOZ. It was something inexpensive to get into shooting Free Pistol with and readily available, where if I choose the FP500 or the MG5, I am going to have to wait months, but I will get a new one.

Bob
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Post by Jon Eulette on Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:51 am

I shot a Toz for many years. As far as free pistols go its forgiving to shoot. The stock grips are horrible and need lots of fitting. I had Morini make me a grip when I was in Switzerland many years ago; made a huge difference. You can't go wrong with a Toz. Last year I picked up a MG5 just because. The grip felt great out of the box and was quickly adjusted. It comes with attachable weights. I'm not really fond of the way they look or attach. Fortunately I like shooting light pistols and do not use them. I like shooting the pistol and look forward to the next 50m match I can find to shoot.
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Post by rkittine on Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:35 am

Thanks Jon,

Its funny I am getting mixed reports on the MG5. A guy on Target-Talk hates his. I am leaning toward doing some shooting first and then think it will be a Walther FP500 or a Pardini K22.

Bob
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