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A sub-forum for state associations:

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A sub-forum for state associations: Empty A sub-forum for state associations:

Post by Founder 2/8/2021, 12:28 pm

I just wanted to add this sub-forum for a test to see if it would be a good place for state associations to discuss their best practices.

If it doesn't take off, I'll get rid of it.

-rob
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A sub-forum for state associations: Empty Washington State R&P Assoc

Post by Wes Lorenz 2/8/2021, 7:50 pm

Match information is on the WSRPA website at: https://wsrpa(dot)org/

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Post by CrankyThunder 2/9/2021, 6:46 am

Rob:

I think that would be a great sub forum.  

While the state of Washington might have a great organization for posting matches, there is not a very good method over here in Michigan for getting information out other then word of mouth and smoke signals.  

While I try and get information out via email and such, there are a lot of shooting opportunities that end up as empty shooting bays on the line at pretty much every match I go to.  I know that I would reference it often and post what matches I am going to a couple days in advance. as well. 

Heck, if you do not believe me, take a look at the posting asking about are there any bullseye matches in central Pennsylvania.  Looks like them keystoners got a lot of choices out there.   

Regards, 
Crankster


Last edited by CrankyThunder on 2/9/2021, 6:49 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Misspellings added to verify authorship by engineer)
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Post by radjag 2/9/2021, 7:27 am

Whilst I am happy if State Reps or shooters are able to post links to calendars, what I dream of is a really comprehensive calendar listing every Precision Pistol event throughout the USA. I know that there is https://precisionshootingmatches.com/
but it appears to somehow be commercial and I guess that many Match Directors don't favour it. I have no "axe to grind"  here, just a selfish desire to make my life easier.

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Post by weber1b 2/9/2021, 8:05 am

When I retire my dream is to be able to travel the country using matches as anchors for trips to new places. Having such a list would be awesome for that. There are folks who try to see games at as many stadiums as possible. Mine would be to shoot matches in as many ranges as possible.

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Post by chiz1180 2/9/2021, 8:15 am

radjag wrote:Whilst I am happy if State Reps or shooters are able to post links to calendars, what I dream of is a really comprehensive calendar listing every Precision Pistol event throughout the USA. I know that there is https://precisionshootingmatches.com/
but it appears to somehow be commercial and I guess that many Match Directors don't favour it. I have no "axe to grind"  here, just a selfish desire to make my life easier.

In part, many match directors tend to be older and want little to do with change. For example one particular club in Northern OH only distributes match information by mail, and to get it you need to be on the list. Perfectly run matches though.


Last edited by chiz1180 on 2/9/2021, 8:16 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : engineer not English major: spelling)

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Post by Slartybartfast 2/10/2021, 10:54 am

radjag wrote:Whilst I am happy if State Reps or shooters are able to post links to calendars, what I dream of is a really comprehensive calendar listing every Precision Pistol event throughout the USA. I know that there is https://precisionshootingmatches.com/
but it appears to somehow be commercial and I guess that many Match Directors don't favour it. I have no "axe to grind"  here, just a selfish desire to make my life easier.
precisionshootingmatches IMO suffers from the same problem as many attempts to create common areas. Very quickly developed into their own way of doing things. IMO, many organisations need a calendar plug-in that can be shared and posted.

I've been a member of many local, provincial, and federal organisations. In all I've seen a huge need. A web developer that is passionate about the activity or organisation and an organisation ready to put out the money required to offer webhosting and support to all member groups at no more than the group membership fees.

Here in Quebec, there's the Federation de Tir du Quebec. They do have a package that clubs can pay for to have their websites use a choice of designs, be hosted, and use online scheduling and payments. But so many clubs don't want to spend the time or money and keep their 1990's era HTML pages hosted on free services.

One organisation that I was a member of did it right. It was expensive. We paid 10's of thousands of dollars to a web development firm to create a modern accessible and content management driven website (https://epcaquebec.org/). We then offered free hosting and basic support to all our member committees.

Getting an "executive manager" was expensive too. But having at least one non-volunteer worker changes the entire dynamic of an organisation. If you didn't have an obsessively devoted organiser before, things started to get done. If you did, things took off.

EPCA's budget may be more than most shooting organisations, but I find it deplorable that NRA, CMP, ISSF, or in Canada CSSA, NFA, CCFR, SFC don't have the drive to step up and do something transformative and uniting for the sport.

Even where these organisations do have good data, they're no better than the individuals that try to create a centralised spot. The data is often fully available if you want to scrape it from their website, but they'll never give you a complete export and updates or give you access to making queries on their database directly. Everyone quibbles and fights for control and influence.

Back to schedules, and perhaps a simple approach:
A simple calendar server and instructions on how to add a widget to a webpage, and how to enter new events. Least amount of intrusion on how it's done at the club level and focused on making the club better.
Then look at making events shareable.
Really needs a larger organisation to drive it. Someone has to be calling clubs and associations to give them the sales pitch to join the system.
A state organisation might have the clout to put a calendar in their system and require all clubs to use it. Then a well run state could branch out helping others and building a nationwide system.

Should be the NRA or the CMP doing this, but...
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Post by javaduke 2/10/2021, 11:34 am

Folks, if we can figure out a way to pay for hosting expenses, I can easily create a web site similar to what we did at Phoenix Rod & Gun, and we can add various options for publishing events, filtering by area, date range, etc. The challenge here is to make the system flexible enough to accommodate all different requirements from all different places (because forcing everyone to do things the same way is nearly impossible). I've been in the software industry for more than 30 years and one thing that I've learned really quickly is that it's extremely difficult to create a product that everyone likes but it's very easy to create one that everyone hates Smile 
Another challenge is that yes, there are some people who don't like technology and who are not even capable of sending emails, let alone managing a calendar on a website. I know quite a few folks like this and there's nothing I can do about it. So the only solution I can think of is a person doing full-time job collecting all the information from all match directors across the world and publishing it on the website. Sorry, but I don't want that job Smile

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Post by Slartybartfast 2/10/2021, 3:37 pm

javaduke wrote:So the only solution I can think of is a person doing full-time job collecting all the information from all match directors across the world and publishing it on the website. Sorry, but I don't want that job Smile
Frankly IMO that's why precisionshootingmatches is where it is.
The NRA still publishes fixed lists, and the CMP system is closed AFAIK.

A SUPER SIMPLE service those two organisations could provide is a calendar widget that affiliated clubs could add to websites to display sanctioned events. And be open to including other disciplines.

If I had the web experience, I think there could be a possible business case for building and maintaining club and association websites, and possibly helping maintain member lists and other club business. But, I've found that unfortunately when it comes to operational expenses the firearms community seems to be a bunch of cheapskates. Taping and re-using 10cent targets over and over and fighting improvements to facilities.

I remember the NRA saying they were going to work on something similar to Practiscore. Practiscore had the advantage of being at the forefront of the creation or popularisation of IDPA. Don't know if the developer is making a ton of cash on the worldwide use of it, but paying for rights and addition of disciplines to a successful and stable platform should be worth it for one of the major organisations. But the wall of trying to control everything and not lose influence is quickly hit.
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Post by Danehogle 4/14/2021, 9:55 pm

I like the idea.... 
and I an ORPA!
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