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Camp Atterbury 2021?

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SteveT
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-TT-
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Orpanaut
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Post by Orpanaut 7/20/2021, 7:31 am

First topic message reminder :

Is there anyone out there who can share some impressions from the NRA National Matches at Camp Atterbury?

I would love to go see for myself but I haven't been able to take the time off from work that would be required to shoot both Perry and Atterbury.  At best I might be able to go look around on Friday afternoon. 

Specifically, I'd like to know about:

1) Range conditions - What's it like to shoot a match there?  Is it the sort of place where you'd feel ready to shoot a personal best?

2) Lodging - What's the availability, cost, proximity?  If 600 shooters come next year, will there be places for them to sleep?

3) Food - What's available on base?  Off base?  

4) Recreation - Are there fun things to do after shooting, or for non-competing family members?

My expectation is that the NRA will just carry over the same modus operandi they've been using at Perry for years, so things should run fairly smoothly.  The catch, I imagine, is that they'll have to groom a new batch of local talent to fill out the lower ranks of the operation.

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Post by Schaumannk 7/21/2021, 9:34 am

There are currently a hundred firing points.   Looks like most the infrastructure is there for at least another fifty to be added quickly.    That would mean that with three or four relays they could handle up to around six hundred competitors total.

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Post by Wobbley 7/21/2021, 9:55 am

Orpanaut wrote:Is there just one pistol range for the Nationals?  How would they manage if there were over 300 shooters there?
There were 450 or so for the preliminary matches.
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Post by james r chapman 7/21/2021, 10:00 am

Wobbley wrote:
Orpanaut wrote:Is there just one pistol range for the Nationals?  How would they manage if there were over 300 shooters there?
There were 450 or so for the preliminary matches.

Where’s that information??
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Post by james r chapman 7/21/2021, 10:39 am

I counted 99 entered in prelims.

https://competitor.nra.org/perryscores/default.aspx?mid=111

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Post by Orpanaut 7/21/2021, 12:10 pm

Is there some sort of Commercial Row at Atterbury?

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Post by -TT- 7/21/2021, 1:17 pm

james r chapman wrote:I counted 99 entered in prelims.

https://competitor.nra.org/perryscores/default.aspx?mid=111


Highest competitor number is 5103, so 104 entries registered, apparently.

Amusing that the URL is under "perryscores". I guess the webmaster has the day off.

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Post by james r chapman 7/21/2021, 1:19 pm

Hadn’t noticed that! Lol
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Post by Al 7/21/2021, 2:50 pm

Wobbley wrote:
Orpanaut wrote:Is there just one pistol range for the Nationals?  How would they manage if there were over 300 shooters there?
There were 450 or so for the preliminary matches.
Saturday afternoon, I asked one of the ladies at the registration desk if she knew how many shooters there were this year. She did a couple clicks & said 861. 
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Post by james r chapman 7/21/2021, 3:22 pm

Al wrote:
Wobbley wrote:
Orpanaut wrote:Is there just one pistol range for the Nationals?  How would they manage if there were over 300 shooters there?
There were 450 or so for the preliminary matches.
Saturday afternoon, I asked one of the ladies at the registration desk if she knew how many shooters there were this year. She did a couple clicks & said 861. 
Al


Yeah, right! Not for Atterbury!

lol!
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Post by straybrit 7/21/2021, 4:22 pm

Maybe that's the number of "entries" - i.e. the number of matches that have been paid for. 

So - 104 bodies. 3 matches for the 2700, one for the prelim. one for DR, one for Harry Reeves, some for team matches.  Hmm - nope - still doesn't add up.

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Post by xman 7/21/2021, 4:35 pm

straybrit wrote:Maybe that's the number of "entries" - i.e. the number of matches that have been paid for. 

So - 104 bodies. 3 matches for the 2700, one for the prelim. one for DR, one for Harry Reeves, some for team matches.  Hmm - nope - still doesn't add up.
Maybe if you add in Juniors and Juniors teams, the numbers may come closer. Also the grand totals may include no shows not yet removed from the attendance list.

We will find out eventually. .... maybe
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Post by john bickar 7/21/2021, 4:43 pm

This looks to be publicly-available, no Facebook account required:
https://www.facebook.com/nracompetitiveshooting/photos/pcb.4140750242645503/4140749982645529/

More at https://www.facebook.com/nracompetitiveshooting/

I've seen some range designs in my day. That's a new one to me.
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Post by Robuc 7/21/2021, 4:58 pm

The roof slopes down range.  Imagine the rain pouring off the roof onto those tables and all your gear.

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Post by xman 7/21/2021, 5:39 pm

john bickar wrote:This looks to be publicly-available, no Facebook account required:
https://www.facebook.com/nracompetitiveshooting/photos/pcb.4140750242645503/4140749982645529/

More at https://www.facebook.com/nracompetitiveshooting/

I've seen some range designs in my day. That's a new one to me.
Someone may have miss read the blueprints.

Strange the SB rifle shooters look like they are in the correct position to shoot 50yd with overhead protection. There is even a line draw on the concrete for them. And they are shooting 50yd targets.

The BE shooters are in the wrong place. No rain protection at all. And the distance might be very wrong.

And there are TONS of space behind the BE shooters so let the BE shooters back up at least 4 feet.

The range staff have to re-measure for the BE line.
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Post by chiz1180 7/21/2021, 5:54 pm

It is more than miss reading the prints. It is lack of caring about the sport. The target frames are a cobbled together after thought and they are far too high for scoring and repairing for a person of average height. It is extremely sad that this is the absolute best that the NRA could bring to the table.
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Post by TonyH 7/21/2021, 6:03 pm

james r chapman wrote:Snicker

Camp Atterbury 2021? - Page 2 80e1b810
I thought in "American" some vowels were expendable.....as in color (colour), humor (humour), flavor (flavour), neighbor (neighbour) etc.....so "inagural" seems just fine! lol!
And this is from a first generation immigrant that learned "English" in the old country as a first language!.....and I have the scars from the nuns teaching English to prove it!


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Post by Schaumannk 7/21/2021, 6:04 pm

I’m sure no one here running the match is responsible for the problems with the range.  This was a project on a working military base.  I intend to treat the NRA refs and officials with the courtesy and respect I always have in the past.   The issues are fixable.   They are doing their best to put on this match and registration took three minutes.

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Post by xman 7/21/2021, 6:42 pm

chiz1180 wrote:It is more than miss reading the prints. It is lack of caring about the sport. The target frames are a cobbled together after thought and they are far too high for scoring and repairing for a person of average height. It is extremely sad that this is the absolute best that the NRA could bring to the table.
Sad that the NRA could not find/assign/volunteer a person(s) local to Atterbury to be part of the on site construction review during building. Persons experienced in SB, BE etc to see whats going on and was experienced in several disciplines to say WHOA! when needed.

Atterbury deserved more attention than just go full speed ahead. Fundamental stuff like the height of the targets, the overhang, accurate distance measuring and all the rest.

my2cents
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Post by Joe Morgan 7/21/2021, 6:43 pm

Can't believe someone like Komplainer Kate actually had something positive to say about what is quite clearly a dud event in a dud place with a dud layout. 

Maybe Wayne LaP and her are old school friends; they could vacation on the same yacht together!

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Post by radjag 7/21/2021, 6:55 pm

Whilst I like Kate's comments. Since Perry was my first time (and the CMP's "kinda" first) and now Atterbury a first for everyone, I have to say that the lack of proper preparation and clearly poor implementation of the new facilities is quite disappointing. No doubt there will be all kinds of finger pointing and blame apportioning, but this is the much anticipated NRA Nationals. Disappointing.

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Post by Schaumannk 7/21/2021, 7:00 pm

xman wrote:
chiz1180 wrote:It is more than miss reading the prints. It is lack of caring about the sport. The target frames are a cobbled together after thought and they are far too high for scoring and repairing for a person of average height. It is extremely sad that this is the absolute best that the NRA could bring to the table.
Sad that the NRA could not find/assign/volunteer a person(s) local to Atterbury to be part of the on site construction review during building. Persons experienced in SB, BE etc to see whats going on and was experienced in several disciplines to say WHOA! when needed.

Atterbury deserved more attention than just go full speed ahead. Fundamental stuff like the height of the targets, the overhang, accurate distance measuring and all the rest.

my2cents
My husband is a Civil Engineer who built half a billion worth of projects in seven years at a large AFB.   I used to work as a contracting officer.  I’ve seen bigger screw ups than this.   Considering the problems over the last 16 months with Covid I suspect no civilian volunteer would have been allowed on the project.  Frankly I am surprised that it got built at all.    These are not normal times.

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Post by xman 7/21/2021, 7:17 pm

Perhaps there needs to be a "follow the money" on the Atterbury project.
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Post by chiz1180 7/21/2021, 7:22 pm

From Results at this link
https://competitor.nra.org/public/ChampionshipResults.aspx#1

Harry Reeves Match: 40 Competitors
Distinguished Revolver Match: 38 Competitors

2700 Aggregate Match: 95 competitors listed
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Post by Schaumannk 7/21/2021, 7:36 pm

Joe Morgan wrote:Can't believe someone like Komplainer Kate actually had something positive to say about what is quite clearly a dud event in a dud place with a dud layout. 

Maybe Wayne LaP and her are old school friends; they could vacation on the same yacht together!
I don’t do yachts(or cruises) I get sea sick.  I’m just a deplorable hick from the high plains of Wyoming.   But if Wayne showed up on the firing line, I would help him in any way I could just like I do for everyone else.   
    We are the best and only ambassadors of our sport.   

Atterbury was hurt by the scheduling.   How many people can afford three weeks away?   I didn’t go to Perry for the CMP matches the year that they were the weekend before Canton, with the NRA at Perry after.  



I admit that I am biased against the CMP.   They are a quasi government organization which receives millions of dollars in Federal grants every year but at least has finally stopped telling the  lie that they are funded solely by *sales* and *donations*.  The CMP historically was about encouraging  and supporting marksmanship.  They used to charge a dollar for a LEG match,  loan you a gun, and provide the ammo.  Now they charge a dollar a shot and treat you like you are in line at the DMV.   USA shooting is the same way.  The tops  of all these organizations are filled with fat cats and bureaucrats.  Can’t think of one exception.  Don’t take it out on the volunteers.   Like all those shooters who run matches, regardless of which organization they certify it with.   Thank you range personnel and match directors who run both CMP and NRA matches. A lot of my friends have been caught in the middle.  I’ve run a two day match.  Got home exhausted and flopped for three days.  It isn’t easy.

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Post by Joe Morgan 7/21/2021, 8:46 pm

Schaumannk wrote:
Joe Morgan wrote:Can't believe someone like Komplainer Kate actually had something positive to say about what is quite clearly a dud event in a dud place with a dud layout. 

Maybe Wayne LaP and her are old school friends; they could vacation on the same yacht together!
I don’t do yachts(or cruises) I get sea sick.  I’m just a deplorable hick from the high plains of Wyoming.   But if Wayne showed up on the firing line, I would help him in any way I could just like I do for everyone else.   
    We are the best and only ambassadors of our sport.   

Atterbury was hurt by the scheduling.   How many people can afford three weeks away?   I didn’t go to Perry for the CMP matches the year that they were the weekend before Canton, with the NRA at Perry after.  



I admit that I am biased against the CMP.   They are a quasi government organization which receives millions of dollars in Federal grants every year but at least has finally stopped telling the  lie that they are funded solely by *sales* and *donations*.  The CMP historically was about encouraging  and supporting marksmanship.  They used to charge a dollar for a LEG match,  loan you a gun, and provide the ammo.  Now they charge a dollar a shot and treat you like you are in line at the DMV.   USA shooting is the same way.  The tops  of all these organizations are filled with fat cats and bureaucrats.  Can’t think of one exception.  Don’t take it out on the volunteers.   Like all those shooters who run matches, regardless of which organization they certify it with.   Thank you range personnel and match directors who run both CMP and NRA matches. A lot of my friends have been caught in the middle.  I’ve run a two day match.  Got home exhausted and flopped for three days.  It isn’t easy.

Where was your charity that you so have for the NRA when you constantly complained about the CMP and Camp Perry? No one is taking anything out on volunteers- the guns are straight at the leadership in both cases. Is it simply because the CMP is a gov funded org, just like you used to be when you collected your check on the behalf of the rest of the country for buying high and selling low, and so, as a quasi-govt org, it just can't turn up a truffle? Is it any better that the NRA has squandered many millions and filled the gas tanks of those with yachts? 

The CMP is a better organization, regardless of the welfare it, and many federal workers and agencies, receive for the single reason that at least for your dollar you get an organization that cares about and facilitates action towards the shooting sports. Full stop. NRA gets private funds, and does f-all for the shooting sports, and haven't cared about us since the 80s.

 If Wayne showed up to the line, not like he is a shooter so we don't have to worry about that, I'd hope he'd be booed off.

Atterbury being a failure has a lot less to do with the ING and a lot more to do with the NRA.

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