Bullseye-L Forum
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

New survey - where do you look?

+9
CR10X
Shue8531
chopper
Jack H
Jon Eulette
Wobbley
chiz1180
xman
mspingeld
13 posters

Page 2 of 2 Previous  1, 2

Go down

Please choose your answer by current classification.

New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_lcap4%New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_rcap 4% 
[ 3 ]
New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_lcap8%New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_rcap 8% 
[ 7 ]
New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_lcap17%New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_rcap 17% 
[ 14 ]
New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_lcap8%New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_rcap 8% 
[ 7 ]
New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_lcap4%New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_rcap 4% 
[ 3 ]
New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_lcap12%New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_rcap 12% 
[ 10 ]
New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_lcap7%New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_rcap 7% 
[ 6 ]
New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_lcap19%New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_rcap 19% 
[ 16 ]
New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_lcap17%New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_rcap 17% 
[ 14 ]
New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_lcap4%New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Vote_rcap 4% 
[ 3 ]
 
Total Votes : 83
 
 

New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Empty New survey - where do you look?

Post by mspingeld 12/22/2021, 12:47 pm

First topic message reminder :

Brian Zins says, look at the target, like throwing a ball.
Jon Eulette says, look at the dot, it's your front sight.

I've recently experimented with look at the target. Good results but too soon to say.

mspingeld

Posts : 730
Join date : 2014-04-19
Age : 62
Location : New Jersey

Fotomaniac and Smokinbear like this post

Back to top Go down


New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Empty Re: New survey - where do you look?

Post by Jon Eulette 12/24/2021, 10:39 pm

Howdy,
The lift and lowering of the arm/pistol is underrated by most. You are correct about it’s importance. I teach/train my pupils about its importance. If we watch a master execute a shot, the lift/lowering of the arm is mechanical and exact. Thus it was trained to be. Lower classifications typically loosey goosey the lift and lower and the shots are indicative of the lack of proper technique.
I have on pentathlon when they woke and went laser pistol. Very disappointing.



Merry Christmas 
Jon


Last edited by Jon Eulette on 12/26/2021, 12:49 am; edited 1 time in total
Jon Eulette
Jon Eulette

Posts : 3737
Join date : 2013-04-15
Location : Southern Kalifornia

Smokinbear likes this post

Back to top Go down

New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Empty Re: New survey - where do you look?

Post by msmith44 12/25/2021, 11:26 pm

Jon Eulette wrote:Howdy,
The lift and lowering of the arm/pistol is underrated by most. You are correct about it’s importance. I teach/train my pupils about its importance. If we watch a master execute a shot, the lift/lowering of the arm is mechanical and exact. Thus it was trained to be. Lower classifications typically loosey goosey the lift and lower and the shots are indicative of the lack of proper technique.
I have on pentathlon when they woke and went laser pistol. Very disappointing.
I graduated MP school in Nov 83 Wink


Merry Christmas 
Jon
Communication is a fragile thing. I should have more clearly defined terms as contextualized it within the Army Marksman Unit Manual's (AMU) concept of "Position." My fault. What I've written below you know but is included for those who might not have investigated the importance of position. I think we can agree that position flaws lead to other problems like trigger jerk. Consistent position results in the dot in the x-ring every time. The shooting with eyes closed is a test of position. It was of course done with proper safety precautions and is a confidence builder for the shooter. If you can shoot tens with your eye's closed maybe you can do it with them open. 

It's interesting that the AMU appears to define it as the natural path taken by the arm in raising the pistol. Find the natural path of the arm lift and adjust the "Stance" accordingly. The AMU recommends testing position before every shot in SF and before every string of Sustained Fire. If it's good enough for John Shue it's good enough for me. 

It's easy to discount position as not as important in NRA Precision Pistol because the pistol can be raised prior to the turning of the targets. But, the timing is important especially in Rapid Fire. Assuming Figure 1 in the AMU is correct, it is best practice to raise the pistol in the interval between "Is line ready" and the turning of the targets, approximately 3 seconds. This allows the dot to be moved into a position where it is in or nearly in the X-Ring (assuming the ability of the shooter to consistently position the pistol). Outdoors the lack of uniform range of acceptable variability in the distance of the X-ring above the ground seems to me problematic. In the sport of Precision Pistol the "precision" part should include the precision of the shooter as well as an acceptable level of precision in the location of the scoring rings. As it is now, "position" can get you in the ball park but not in the strike zone. It is a factor in Rapid Fire.

You don't have the Position variable in ISSF where it's part of the rules (along with everything else including shoes). In ISSF 25 meter Rapid Fire mastery of Position is a given. Without it, you cannot at the turn of the target raise your pistol, hunt for the X-ring and break the clean shot in the three seconds before the target turns back. You raise the pistol, you're in the strike zone and in the process of breaking the shot. It is Mr. Hall's ideal of the single action shot. 

Of course, the CMP start position requires a ready position, raise the pistol, etc. Position is highly important in the successful breaking of the first shot.

What has happened the MP is sad. They have eliminated the Equestrian event effective next year. Running and swimming events have been shortened and shooting is included in running a la Biathlon. Only one American qualified for the last Olympics. While my time was cut short by a riding injury, the months I spent training as the only civilian attached to an all military group was life changing. I wish I could have continued shooting but there weren't the options available to a civilian, at least this civilian, in the early sixties. At my advanced age, I'm making up lost ground one shot at a time.

Best wishes for the New Year,


-m-

msmith44

Posts : 49
Join date : 2020-10-13
Age : 78
Location : Washington State

Back to top Go down

New survey - where do you look? - Page 2 Empty Re: New survey - where do you look?

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 2 of 2 Previous  1, 2

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum