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CMP 2023 rule changes

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Post by rsp Fri Jan 06, 2023 7:28 pm

First topic message reminder :

I was just looking up something in the as-issued 1911 rules and noticed the CMP has new rulebooks for 2023. A couple of the changes seem significant to me. Thoughts?


https://thecmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/PistolRuleChanges.pdf


Highlights:

  • No more jacketed bullets required for EIC Service Pistol, or M&P/As-Issued for that matter. All CMP matches are going to use "any safe ammo".
  • Civilians can be a "new shooter" in the NTT match for *two* years.
  • No more list of approved service pistols. Any service type semi-auto, in caliber 9mm-.45 ACP, meeting the requirements (open sights, symmetrical grips, 4lb trigger, <5.5" bbl, etc) is OK.

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Post by tovaert Sun Feb 05, 2023 10:56 am

What is the "desirability" of shooting a .38MR as a service pistol? Less recoil?

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Post by SmokinNJokin Sun Feb 05, 2023 11:27 am

I’m not getting riled up about this… i see both sides of the argument. But the spirit of service pistol is alive and well at all-army. Rack grade, as-issue guns and army issue ball ammo. Truly level playing field. That being said… the people who practice the hardest are still going to get the leg points. And Army still has the most restrictive path to distinguished. But hey, if this is what it takes to revive the sport, i guess its worth it.

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Post by chiz1180 Sun Feb 05, 2023 2:37 pm

tovaert wrote:What is the "desirability" of shooting a .38MR as a service pistol? Less recoil?
Yes, less recoil.

However much more difficult to get an accurate load for 50 (don't believe me, look in the ammo section and see how many people have difficulties loading 38spl wadcutters). Magazines are far more finicky too. The age old advice is still true, if you have a good shot process and are able to follow it, a 45 will always score higher.
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Post by fc60 Sun Feb 05, 2023 4:44 pm

Greetings,

I tested my 38 National Match (Gold Cup) barrel at 50 yards.

I was getting flyers also.

Cheers,

Dave

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Post by Jon Eulette Sun Feb 05, 2023 5:35 pm

Dave, Dave, Dave, barrel fixture vs sloppy loose pistol doesn’t count, no cheating lol.
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Post by chiz1180 Sun Feb 05, 2023 5:49 pm

Dave,

How easily can an equivalent (or better) result be achieved in 9mm or 45? Can that same result be achieved with currently available projectiles as easily?

Christopher
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Post by L Valdez Sun Feb 05, 2023 11:09 pm

I was almost admonished for shooting a Service Pistol EIC match years after I became distinguished. The club wanted the non-distinguished shooter to "win" the gold medal. I felt I earned the win, shooting 273 with 230 grain hardball, whereas the ND shooter shot 185 grain ammo and earned a 6 point leg with his score of 221.
Only because he convinced his girlfriend to shoot the match (she was the 5th nondistinguished shooter on the line) he got points. His girlfriend shot a score of 53.

After that match, I never shot another SP EIC match.

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Post by fc60 Mon Feb 06, 2023 11:44 am

Greetings,

With a lot of testing and using GOOD bullets small groups are possible with most calibers we shoot.

A new shooter that was unable to get GOOD bullets from online vendors starting casting his own.

The target below is with a SAECO/REDDING #69 200 grain flat base mould. Alloy was 22lr range salvage plus 5% Tin (94-4-1). Sized 0.452".

The barrel is from a Springfield Range Officer. Groove diameter 0.4525".

Distance is 50 yards.

Ten shots.

Cheers,

Dave

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Post by BE Mike Mon Feb 06, 2023 1:05 pm

I got distinguished using a well used 1911 that wouldn't machine rest under 4" groups at 50 yards using factory hardball. It does shoot groups about half that size with the "Marine Load". After getting my badge, I started shooting leg matches with a Kidd accurized Beretta 92 FS. Because of shoulder problems, I thought the lighter recoil would be easier on me. Back then, we were restricted to using only bullet weights that were typically found in military issued ammo. I used the 115 gr. bullet, but had to drive it so fast that it wasn't any advantage over the .45 ACP factory hardball. I ended up shooting about the same scores with the Beretta as I had done with my 1911. I think the 4 lb. minimum trigger pull is the hardest thing to learn, especially in sustained fire. I doubt whether any of the newer pistols will shoot anymore accurately than my old 1911 hardball gun with any ammo. I doubt that the triggers on the latest pistols allowed will break better than that old hardball gun. It all boils down to the competitor and his/ her familiarity and skill with his/her gun and ammo. To excel at this sport requires some level of sacrifice. Whoever puts in the most and focused training will get leg points. The duffers will walk away disappointed, as always.
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Post by Wes Lorenz Mon Feb 06, 2023 7:30 pm

Since we're measuring...........Barsto with real HB. 


CMP 2023 rule changes - Page 4 Barsto12

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Post by Jon Eulette Mon Feb 06, 2023 7:37 pm

Wes Lorenz wrote:Since we're measuring...........Barsto with real HB. 


CMP 2023 rule changes - Page 4 Barsto12
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Post by chiz1180 Mon Feb 06, 2023 9:20 pm

Just for fun, this is the gun that I got my hard leg with at Canton last year, 271-8x with stock Springfield barrel, bushing and slide stop.
CMP 2023 rule changes - Page 4 Img_4110
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