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NRA REGIONAL FORMAT

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NRA REGIONAL FORMAT

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Total Votes : 66
 
 
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Post by fc60 1/22/2023, 11:47 am

Greetings,

Please vote for your preference.

Cheers,

Dave
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Post by SteveT 1/22/2023, 12:09 pm

I almost always prefer a 2700. If I'm going to prep for and drive to a match, I'd rather shoot all day. You don't ask, but my second choice would be two gun 1800 which definitely makes for a shorter and easier day, especially if there are EIC's after.

If it's a 2 or 3 day Regional then definitely a 2700.

Probably I'm just used to the 900 format, but I find a 60 shot match (2xSF, 2xTF, 2xRF) to be too short.
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Post by CR10X 1/22/2023, 1:13 pm

The shorter the match, the more chances that lady luck gets involved in the outcome.

CR

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Post by Wobbley 1/22/2023, 1:19 pm

I voted for the 3gun 1800.  For two reasons. First, the nationals are a 2700.  In most other disciplines regionals are shorter than what is shot at the nationals.  High power was a 2400–3 times longer than an 800 regional.  Smallbore prone has a 6400 national.  A regional shooting a 6400 can’t do it in one day.  So regionals were more often 3200s.
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Post by Wobbley 1/22/2023, 1:21 pm

CR10X wrote:The shorter the match, the more chances that lady luck gets involved in the outcome.

CR
Then why not make it a 5400 or 27000?  The match is the match.  You show up and shoot for record.  At the end of the day the person with the most points wins.
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Post by CR10X 1/22/2023, 1:31 pm

Personally, I'd shoot as long and with as many shots as they can put in the schedule.  That's one reason, in my opinion, that a 3 day 2700 is a pretty good test of competitor over equipment and luck. 

So you want a one-shot match?  And start testing guns in a Ransom rest with 2 round groups?  

CR

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Post by Wobbley 1/22/2023, 1:49 pm

That’s the format of a lot of “Turkey shoots”.  But that aside, all a match determines is who was best on that day under those conditions. Just like a particular race on a particular day in NASCAR.  The nationals are longer to reduce the effect of happenstance.
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Post by CR10X 1/22/2023, 2:22 pm

I think that's my point.  A Regional should be very, very close to the level of Nationals.  Contest over as many days as possible, weather, mental fatigue, etc.  Otherwise its just a Saturday match with just a few more people.  I consider some other Regionals I've shot to be right up there with the Nationals in terms of quality of competition.  Just hate to see that aspect get diluted along with all the other changes.

But, what will be will be.  Its the people that put on the match that have the final "Say"  And having the "Say" beats "voting' every time.

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Post by chiz1180 1/22/2023, 2:52 pm

Depends on the availability of the range and realistic demand. For example if the range is only 12-15 points, 25-30 people want to shoot, and the range is only available for one day, that is a stretch for multiple relays for a full 2700. If that same range only has enough demand for the amount of firing points a full 2700 makes more sense. Adding EICs can complicate it as well. 

Running matches is difficult. You can not make everyone happy and almost always resources to run the match are limited. Some people straight up will not show up to shoot an 1800 regardless of 2 gun or 3 gun, even if the match is run as well as or better than a 2700. 

I like multiple day 2700s personally but I understand that making that happen is not always an option.
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Post by Soupy44 1/22/2023, 3:05 pm

I miss the 2 day smallbore matches, 1200 or 1600 each day (used to do 2400 two days in a row in April). I'd love more 2-3 day BE matches, but I understand most folks don't have as flexible a schedule as I do.

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Post by SingleActionAndrew 1/22/2023, 3:17 pm

2-3x EIC too, right?
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Post by 4th Corner Traveler 1/23/2023, 1:51 am

Being honest, an 1800 is not worth the drive and time for me (unless the Boss has something going on in that area Smile).  A 2700, whether a single day or 3 day event is still the most favorable.  Something about the last 90 shots in the 45 stage seems to make or break many shooters. 

Also, the club's range time now days is at premium.  It is not like it was 30+ years ago when it was not a problem to schedule a weekend for a match, for either rifle or pistol. Then add the reality that everyone wants to play but no one wants to run it.  

Did you realize that if you shoot and score a 50/25y 2700, you walk over a mile? What better way to get in some exercise, punch holes in paper and hang with a group of decent folks!

Thanks Dave!

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Post by RADJAG 1/23/2023, 5:01 am

I guess that I was spoilt when I started Bullseye up in Oregon 4 years ago. There was two 2700 matches per month (TCGC & EEGC) through the season. Plenty of firing points at both ranges so only one relay. Normally an 09.00 start. 22 & CF comfortably in the morning. 45mins or so for lunch. 45 then at least two NMC's in the afternoon, usually finished by 16.00. The Regional was the same, maybe running on a little later with 22EIC, SP, DR & Harry Reeves.

Even though there was usually at least a couple of "slow coaches" when scoring/repairing, the matches always seemed to proceed quite efficiently. Hats off to the great guys who run those matches.

Having widened my horizons to experience events in other places I get quite frustrated when the pace of play becomes slow (usually due to frequent alibis, dare I mention M41's?, and folks who think that the target line is a place to socialize).

I endure the same problem on the golf course, slow play by selfish individuals ruins the game.

Assuming that there are enough positions to accommodate all shooters in a single relay there should be no problem to complete a full 2700 + EIC's in one day. IMHO.

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Post by Dcforman 1/23/2023, 6:27 am

Roy, did you forget your password again?  lol!

Dave

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Post by RADJAG 1/23/2023, 6:32 am

Dave,

Well spotted!

Actually, no. I have been going through my computer and "cloud" identifying many things that were "backed up" carefully which are now non-existent. So far, none are "mission critical", just very annoying. During that process I decided to resurrect my former, and true, persona!

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Post by fc60 1/23/2023, 10:58 am

Greetings,

Time for a Geezer story.

I shot my first Registered Regional Match at Paul Bunyan Rifle and Sportsman in Puyallup, WA in 1976.

It was a two day match.

Day one was 22 and CF followed by 22 and CF Team matches.

Day two was 45, 45 Team match, and DCM Leg match.

Each day had THREE relays. Each relay had 24 shooters.

The 50 yard Slow Fire portion was fired on the rifle range and the 25 yard portion on the pistol range. This made the event run quicker.

In between relays, you got to visit with other shooters while resting up.

The club had a kitchen serving burgers and hot dogs.

The Military presence was strong. A lot of National Guard from Army and Air Force.

Wow, things have changed. I miss the "good old days".

Cheers,

Dave
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Post by Toz35m 1/25/2023, 12:23 pm

Dave,  I know there is an issue in WA and many of the matches have been shortened to 1800.  I would prefer to shoot a 2700.  It is a tough call to drive 2-3 hrs for an 1800.  But the benefit is I would get home sooner and might not be as tired.
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Post by Wobbley 1/25/2023, 12:47 pm

Dave brings up a point.  Years ago regional matches were larger and held over 2 days.  Now it’s all crammed into one day.  So there is only one relay.  Which barely works.

Rifle shooters shoot 80 shots for a regional and no one complains.  Some used to shoot 100 shots, but those have almost disappeared.  I’ve been trying to find a program of a current smallbore regional and not finding much. But an ISSF World Cup championship has a 60 shot qualifier followed by a 40 shot Ranking match then a Gold shot for shot match.   So maybe a 270 shot regional is a bit overkill.
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Post by Soupy44 1/25/2023, 1:13 pm

I believe most smallbore regionals are all 2 days minimum. First day irons, second day any sights, possibly a Friday team day or a Monday 3p day for a prone regional. 

They can be one day though.

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Post by Allgoodhits 1/25/2023, 1:58 pm

I shoot at 3 different ranges 150 miles rd trip to my local area. None have drawn enough shooters to offer a big leg in EIC matches and occasionally they cancel EIC because they don't have enough for one leg. 

Traffic is horrendous in the area so it makes for a very long day at match end for most. At one of the ranges they are not permitted to shoot CF after 1 pm, due to noise and the nearby communities. At that range they most often do 2X900 1800s. I guess it would be blasphemy to shoot CF and .45 first then .22 to beat the clock.

I think 2023 will be last year for BE at my home range which celebrates it's 75th year this year. It seems the yutes like to arrive either AM or PM, shoot their 70-100 rds in IDPA in a couple hrs, then go do other things. Me thinks they may be having more fun.

I voted for 3 gun 1800 in the survey. Finding primers came into that decision too.
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Post by chiz1180 1/25/2023, 3:33 pm

Allgoodhits wrote:Traffic is horrendous in the area so it makes for a very long day at match end for most. At one of the ranges they are not permitted to shoot CF after 1 pm, due to noise and the nearby communities. At that range they most often do 2X900 1800s. I guess it would be blasphemy to shoot CF and .45 first then .22 to beat the clock.
I have always been tempted to run one of my matches in reverse order, 45, CF, then 22. I think the biggest complaint would be that it is 'different' than normal.
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Post by SteveT 1/25/2023, 4:40 pm

Go for it! and shoot RF, RF, TF, TF, RF, TF, SF, SF, SF!

I was on the line at CP around 2007(?) when a storm came through near the end of teams. We had to come back the next morning, 3 minutes prep and shoot Rapid Fire. Then box 'em up and clear the line for relay 1. It was... interesting. It's more fun to look back on it now than it was in the moment, but it's the weird experiences that we really remember.
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Post by SaraiEsq 1/25/2023, 9:15 pm

chiz1180 wrote:
I have always been tempted to run one of my matches in reverse order, 45, CF, then 22. I think the biggest complaint would be that it is 'different' than normal.

Imagine how light the .22 recoil would feel after shooting 180 rounds of .45!  


Also, could someone tell me what an "NRA Regional" is and how it plays into the grand scheme of things?
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Post by chiz1180 1/26/2023, 7:08 am

SaraiEsq wrote:
Also, could someone tell me what an "NRA Regional" is and how it plays into the grand scheme of things?
A regional is/was typically a larger 2700 match over there course of a few days. Often these matches include Team matches (much like at nationals), DR, and EIC matches. The theory is that these matches draw competitors from a specific region and can be seen as a warm up for nationals. Canton’s big match is a regional, Bristol IN has/had a regional, there is one in FL as well (obviously missing some, these are just the ones that come to mind).
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