Bull Barrel 1911 for bullseye ?

Hi All,
After several years bullseye hiatus I am getting back into the sport.
I am looking at a Bul Armory 1911 with a bull barrel.
Does anyone have experience with bull barrel for bullseye instead of competition barrel and bushing ? 

Thank you,
AJ

I had an STI Range Master many years ago. Initially tight the barrel fit wore down ever so slightly lose(er).  I am nitpicking. Accuracy remained the same at my level of shooting.  None of my bushing guns had that, so I tend to stay away from bull barrels.  I had a pleasure of handling few Bul Armory pistols and they are very very nice indeed.  Not sure about bullseye use.

I owned two STI Range Masters at one time, a 38 Super and a 45, both sold on. The 38 was newish and shot well, the 45 was mediocre. Not familiar with BUL.

I doubt that a bull barrel 1911 is the best choice for Bullseye. But if the price is right and it shoots well, OK.

I was intrigued by your mention of BUL Armory so looked them up - yet another Turkish brand offering what look like quite well put together 1911's and clones. Their primary target market seems to be the "run & gun" crowd who prefer 2011 double stack frames - good luck to them!

Seems that the BUL 1911 Government (single stack with Novak style sights) sells for about $900. But they are relatively hard to find.

I and several others have tried and tested TISAS (also from Turkey) 1911 Government models (single stack). They seems to be quite well built and offer a good starting point (much like a Springfield) for a Bullseye gun. They are quite a bit cheaper than BUL, about $400 for an A1 and ~$650 for one with Novak sights, and are widely available -hundreds on GunBroker.

Whilst all of these TISAS A1's are fine for "As Issued" and similar comps. It is hard to find any already fitted with an adjustable rear sight (Kensight/Bomar style) which is much better for Service Pistol. Strangely, AFAIK, TISAS only offer their D10 version with adjustable rear sight in 10mm for about ~$700 
https://tisasusa.com/tisas-1911-d10/

Of course if the intention is to fit a rail and red dot, then the basic A1 models are fine.

All of them will most likely need a trigger job and possibly a bit of tightening. IMHO. YMMV!

BUL is made in Israel. BUL has a history of making mid-market to high-end practical competition guns (unlike the Turkish brands) and has a longer history with the U.S. market (Kimber’s first line of double-stack “race gun” 1911s were BUL products). They’re not comparable to Turkish guns at all.

That said, a bull barrel gun seems like a poor choice for bullseye because, if it doesn’t shoot precise enough out of the box, there isn’t much you can do. A bushing gun is easier to tighten up for precision use and that precision can be maintained with new bushings over time. Bull barrels are more of an advantage in practical run-and-gun sports where heavy barrel/light slide physics and 3” at 25 yard accuracy are enough to win in a competent shooter’s hands.

For the price of most BUL guns, you can get a gun better suited for this sport. A new or used Springfield Armory with an adjustable rear sight is a common base gun. My old Range Officer needed only an EGW drop-in angle bore bushing to shoot to bullseye standards (sub-3” at 50 yards). I found that gun for $550 in a local used gun case four years ago.

JRV, thank you for correcting me! Yes, indeed they are made in Israel.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BUL_Armory

Moral being -don't believe everything you read on GunBroker without cross checking!!!

Anyhow, for the OP, yes, I do agree with JRV, there are better options out there than a new bull barreled 1911.

Any mass produced production bull barreled 1911 will not have the fit of a true BE pistol at least any I have seen. A true Cone style BE pistol( sometimes called bull) I believe is superior to a bushing pistol as it onlyhas one tolerance to manage. KART has a true cone style and KKMs can be converted fairly easily to a cone style. Wear does not seem to be any issue and if it was it would be simple to have it laser welded up and recut.

jglenn21 wrote:A true Cone style BE pistol( sometimes called bull)  I believe is superior to a bushing pistol as it only has one tolerance to manage. KART has a true cone style and KKMs can be converted fairly easily to a cone style. Wear does not seem to be any issue and if it was it would be simple to have it laser welded up and recut.

Hello,

All true.  Many fine pistols smiths (Mr. Jerry Keefer - rip, Mr. Brandan Bunker, et. al.) prefer coned barrels.  I have a six inches M1911 by Mr. Ted Yost that uses a coned barrel by Barstow.  It is as accurate a pistol as I have ever seen.  The secret is....they have to be done correctly by an experienced pistol smith.  Cone/bull barrels are not a massed produced type of item.

Jim

During a short stint with an employer that had us living in North Carolina years ago, I stopped over to Deep River Custom to pick up a pistol they had worked on for me. I don’t recall the conversation but I asked them which style (bushing or bull) they would choose if a guy asked them to build the most accurate pistol possible.  They said bull. I don’t think I asked why or at least I don’t remember. I don’t know the details but I believe pistolsmiths have to open up areas within the bushing in some sort of nonconcentric way when they fit things.  I wonder how this same fit would get accomplished with no bushing.
Happy Thanksgiving.

For clarity, a true bull barrel is a larger diameter barrel which is fit to the slide without the use of a front bushing or cone. A cone barrel lockup, often referred to as a cone bushing is typically installed on a threaded standard barrel and that cone or oversized "muzzle end" is then fit to the slide in the same/similar manner that a bull barrel is. A cone bushing threaded onto the barrel, then fit to the slide may or may not have a compensator as part of it.

I would suggest the cone bushing approach for the following reason. If slide fitment at muzzle changes, or cone changes, or barrel changes, you can fit a new cone to the barrel and slide or you may be able to fit the existing cone which is already fit to that slide, to a new threaded barrel. If you go with a bull barrel fitment, then if the slide or the barrel loosen up, then you are limited. You could turn the bull barrel down and fit a cone or standard bushing, but that may equal or exceed the cost of a new barrel. A cone bushing barrel can have a new cone bushing fit, just as a conventional barrel can have a new barrel bushing fit.

I do agree that a properly fit bull or cone lockup "on paper" should be more accurate because of fewer tolerances. I don't think that on paper position holds true on the range. Last another possible advantage with a bull barrel, and to lesser degree cone bushing barrel is added weight which some may prefer. I would also add that a bull or cone bushing lockup, does not require "turning" of a bushing for disassembly. Another argument could be that each time you have to turn that tightly fit, minimal tolerance bushing on a conventional lockup to remove the barrel from the slide, some degree of wear, stretching or loosening takes place, even when done properly.

My $.02 for thought.