Choice of a Service Pistol M9 or Sig 210

by RANGERRON72 10/20/2022, 9:00 am

Been gone from Service Pistol shooting (1966-1998) a long time and the rules for matches have opened up to something other than a M1911 hardball gun from Les Baer.

What advice can you give if I am looking at a 9mm pistol for EIC and P100 shooting in 9mm? Also Bullet and powder recommendations, I have quite a supply of Bullseye.

TIA

by Allgoodhits 10/20/2022, 9:08 am

1911 in 9mm or .38 Super. Much easier to find a vast array of parts and gunsmiths when needed.

In case you are unaware, you need not shoot 230 ball any longer with a .45. Many, if not most today when using a 1911 .45 in EIC shoot a 185 JHP round. Zero and Nosler appear to be the favored projectiles, although there are a number of others.

by **Wobbley** 10/20/2022, 11:22 am

Most 9mm shooters futz around with ammo until they find an acceptable load for 50, quit, then just muddle through. 38 Super and or 38 SuperComp seem to be much more forgiving to find a load that works, especially in the 130-147 grain weight.

As for pistols, there aren’t many M9 smiths out there. The military just dropped the M9 as the service pistol adopting the Sig 320 as the M17/M18 pistols. There aren’t many smiths building NM grade M17 versions, but I’ve heard that they’re accurate enough. IMO, The only fly in the ointment is the issue sights. I’d opt for an M17 over an M9.

by Kp321 10/20/2022, 11:38 am

Your original question about M-9 vs SIG 210 is comparing apples to oranges. Out of the box the 210 is extremely accurate but the trigger is a little light for CMP rules. A spring change can fix that. I don’t own a M-9/B92 but the ones I have shot can’t hold a candle to the 210. My 210 likes 115 gr RMR Match Winners with 4 gr of Bullseye.

by RoyDean 10/20/2022, 11:46 am

The SIG P210 Target (made in USA) is a lovely gun. Only issue is that you will most likely need to swap a small spring to increase the trigger pull weight (there are threads here describing that). And for good 50yd accuracy I found that 147JHP bullets at lower velocity worked best (other threads here too).

Depending on your hand size, the standard target grips might be a bit big, but there are several after-market options.

I was never able to get good results from a 1911 in 9mm, but I admit that I did not try very hard to upgrade the ones I had. Eventually decided to get out of 9mm altogether and prefer to shoot a 1911 in 45 with 185JHP match ammo now.

by Orion 10/20/2022, 4:56 pm

I have two Beretta M9's that shoot ~1.5" groups. KKM 1:32" barrels with 115gr. I've been told by AMU gunsmiths that 147gr have been historically inaccurate with KKM's 1:32 in the past and 115gr are the best in class for 9mm with that barrel.

I decided to continue shooting 9mm for hardball because I've found it much easier to get ammo / reloading supplies for 9mm. Large pistol primers or 45 185gr ammo continues to be overly expensive and/or hard to find. The biggest pro of shooting 45 is the bullet size. The biggest pro to shooting 9mm is the lighter recoil.

by robert84010 10/20/2022, 8:49 pm

RANGERRON72 wrote:Been gone from Service Pistol shooting (1966-1998) a long time and the rules for matches have opened up to something other than a M1911 hardball gun from Les Baer.

What advice can you give if I am looking at a 9mm pistol for EIC and P100 shooting in 9mm? Also Bullet and powder recommendations, I have quite a supply of Bullseye.

TIA

Ron,
As I type this Vihtavuouri 330 is available at powdervalleyinc.com and it is like magic dust in my 9mm's. I have two Kidd M9's and a 1911. VV330 under a 115 XTP/HAP bullet deliver incredible precision in a well built pistol. Bullseye is too fast for 9mm and makes it snappy which is a complaint by some about a 9mm.

If you want a 9mm for EIC and shoot the 1911 well then build a 1911. The best part of this route is you can easily customize it to fit your hand. Plus you can put a match grade 22 conversion on top and shoot a ton of 22 to master that 4lb trigger.

by toddcfii 10/21/2022, 9:12 am

“If you want a 9mm for EIC and shoot the 1911 well then build a 1911. The best part of this route is you can easily customize it to fit your hand. Plus you can put a match grade 22 conversion on top and shoot a ton of 22 to master that 4lb trigger.”

FYI. Not all conversion work on a 9mm frame. The ejector is in a different format and interferes with the conversion going on. I am not aware of any that will work. But others may have had luck with it.

by Arthur 10/21/2022, 5:40 pm

1911 .45 ACP is the King service pistol. Had to say it.
I wanted a reasonably accurate not too expensive 9mm. The forum got me hyped up on the XDm.
My .45 ACP SRO was in NC getting rebuilt so I tried the XDm in a match. Shot 258 in a NJ EIC match with 86 on the long line. 147 Speer Lawman @ 50 and Blazer 115 FMJ @ 25, both factory FMJ loads. No real practice before hand. Out of the box stock gun.
Can't say it's a fantastic gun, but it's pretty good for what it is.

Best regards,
Arthur

by robert84010 10/21/2022, 9:57 pm

toddcfii wrote:

“If you want a 9mm for EIC and shoot the 1911 well then build a 1911. The best part of this route is you can easily customize it to fit your hand. Plus you can put a match grade 22 conversion on top and shoot a ton of 22 to master that 4lb trigger.”

FYI. Not all conversion work on a 9mm frame. The ejector is in a different format and interferes with the conversion going on. I am not aware of any that will work. But others may have had luck with it.

My Kart and Marvel fit with no problems. My guy said he used a Caspian ejector on the build.

by sfcrobertson 10/22/2022, 8:17 am

I say the SIG P210 is the best choice. The only gunsmithing needed is a new trigger return spring, and grips (Palm swell)? A guy I was shooting with made the point that a SIG 210 is a $1500 gun, and will be worth that after all is said and done. However, when you buy a $800 gun and spend another $800 or more on it to shoot as well as the P210 that is it still an $800 gun to 99% of the world. IMHOP

by rich.tullo 10/22/2022, 9:22 pm

The most accurate possible is 1911 with a 1985 jhp. Good guns come up on this forum or get a Springer and send it to a decent smith and get a KKM Barrel.

If you are looking for a cheap accurate 9MM, Walther PPQ 5 inch, LPA Adjustable rear sight, Dynamic Trigger Kit from Walther, and jarvis Barrel and you should be under $1000 if you get a used PPQ. Using the stock trigger return spring you are right at #4.1 Mine is cable of cleaning the short line.

by Rush223 12/23/2022, 5:45 pm

I have an accurized baretta that is amazingly accurate but I don’t shoot it very well. Bought the Sig 210A and absolutely love it. I replaced the trigger spring and use Hogue grips. I don’t like shooting it in rain because disassembly is more tricky than a 1911.

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