Dry Firing The 1911

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Dry Firing The 1911

Post by WV1911SHOOTER on Mon Dec 01, 2014 3:52 pm

Guys, would one of you kind gentleman please advise me on the proper procedure for dry firing driils using my 1911.

As always, TIA.

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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by hongach on Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:20 pm

For starters if you are dry firing at home make sure you have no live ammo around where you are practicing and you firearm is empty.

For me I just use my standard shot process, focus on a smooth consistent trigger pull and try to achieve the surprise trigger break without disturbing the sight picture. The 1911 is great to dry fire since you do not have to disturb anything just pull the hammer back with your thumb and you are ready to go again. I use a modified target to simulate the black at 50 yards since I dry fire indoors at about 35 ft. Also, not totally necessary, but you can use a snap cap to protect you firing pin.

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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Rob Kovach on Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:27 pm

1- write down your shot process. (i.e.--obtain proper stance, grip gun correctly, loop weak hand on belt, raise gun, start trigger movement, focus on front sight, settle sights, break shot, call shot, follow through back to aiming point, visualize perfect shot, lower gun)
2- dryfire using that process 
3- recock the gun
4- set down gun
5- repeat steps until fatigued either mentally or physically
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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by TexasShooter on Mon Dec 01, 2014 6:27 pm

I've wondered about this too. I was told that dry firing is fine but re-cock by racking the slide instead of by just pulling the hammer back, as it would damage the trigger components in some way. Any truth to that?

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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Rob Kovach on Mon Dec 01, 2014 7:04 pm

We discussed this recently, and the conclusions were that it really doesn't matter if you just cock the hammer or rack the slide.
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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Astroimage2002 on Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:47 pm

Rob Kovach wrote:1- write down your shot process. (i.e.--obtain proper stance, grip gun correctly, loop weak hand on belt, raise gun, start trigger movement, focus on front sight, settle sights, break shot, call shot, follow through back to aiming point, visualize perfect shot, lower gun)
2- dryfire using that process 
3- recock the gun
4- set down gun
5- repeat steps until fatigued either mentally or physically
Rob, 

I know you have shared it in the past but I would like to ask you to share your shot process with us again. 

Brian

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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Astroimage2002 on Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:53 pm

TexasShooter wrote:I've wondered about this too. I was told that dry firing is fine but re-cock by racking the slide instead of by just pulling the hammer back, as it would damage the trigger components in some way. Any truth to that?
My comments... Put your finger lightly on the trigger then pull it back the hammer, what do you feel? The hammer engaging the sear the the hammer engaging the full cock notch? ...Now, try it again pulling the trigger back to its stop then pulling the hammer... any different?

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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by CR10X on Mon Dec 01, 2014 9:48 pm

This goes on and on and on..... 

There is a sear, disconnector, hammer and a couple of pin that locate them in the frame.  If holding back the trigger kept the sear from touching the hammer, then why doesn't the hammer fall all the way when the slide operates after firing a shot.  That little disconnector gets operated and the sear is now free from the confines of the trigger you are now holding for no reason. 

Set up the pins on the outside of the frame with the sear and hammer.  Get a good magnifying glass.  And take a look. 

When the hammer rotates past the sear, what area of the sear could be touching the hammer?   It ain't the same area that engages the hammer hooks, its the edge of the sear secondary angle.  That's what you feel against the hammer when you pull the hammer back.  The primary face only sets against the hammer hooks and is what you feel disengaging (either a little = crisp or a lot = roll). 

Now the edge of the hammer hooks may get some wear, but that is not the major area of engagement.   How do sears and hammers get beat up?  Having the hooks too short and the hammer follows from trigger inertia or setting the overtravel too short so the hammer hooks are clipping the secondary edge of the sear on the way past.     

Damn, now I've got to dryfire 20 more minutes tonight.  I posted too much yesterday and my arm is tired from that much dryfiring.

I'm out now.

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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Jon Eulette on Mon Dec 01, 2014 10:18 pm

+1 on the over travel being set up to tight. I replace a lot of hammers and sears every year on guns that were set up with the hammer half cock battering the sear.
Jon
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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Rob Kovach on Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:33 am

Brian,

I don't think I've ever posted my shot process before.  The list that I have above is the process that I'm using right now.

There was a thread that had a photo of a long, handwritten shot process posted in it, but I can't seem to find that....meanwhile enjoy these threads:
http://www.bullseyeforum.net/t1691-developing-a-shot-process?highlight=process
http://www.bullseyeforum.net/t982-shot-plan-cheat-sheet?highlight=plan
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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Ed Hall on Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:19 am

You may like to check out the following:

Improving Hold and Trigger Manipulation

Trivial Dry Fire Questions

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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by dronning on Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:22 am

I'm working on reducing my shot process to the following 3 steps:

Pick up gun
Shoot X (or X's for sustained fire)
Put down gun

It's still in development Laughing

- Dave
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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Ed Hall on Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:26 am

dronning wrote:I'm working on reducing my shot process to the following 3 steps:

Pick up gun
Shoot X (or X's for sustained fire)
Put down gun

It's still in development Laughing

- Dave
That follows my belief in the ultimate shot progression and mirrors all the other things we have learned to do via our subconscious:

pick up glass - take drink - set down glass...
stab meat with fork - place in mouth - remove fork...
get up - walk up stairs - sit down...
...
...

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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Axehandle on Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:44 pm

I think one of the hotdawg IPSC shooters is credited with saying. "Practice does NOT make perfect.  Perfect practice makes perfect."   That goes for paper punchers too.  Dry fire exactly like you live fire.  Anything less is more than just simply wasted time.   You may be developing bad habits that could easily have a negative effect on your live fire shooting.

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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by jmdavis on Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:10 pm

I heard "Practice does NOT make perfect.  Perfect practice makes perfect." from my football coach in 1980. So I think that it goes back a ways.
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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by james r chapman on Mon Aug 10, 2015 11:26 pm

Harvey Penick, 1947...

or,

John Wooden, UCLA 1964
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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by BE Mike on Tue Aug 11, 2015 9:32 am

After a lot of dryfiring, you may cause the firing pin stop to crack. It is a good idea, especially before a match, to check the firing pin stop (the cracks usually start from the hole and work outward). This is not meant to deter you from dry firing. Dry firing can be a good training tool, if you dry fire each shot with the effort and process that you do when shooting. Not to belittle anyone, but look very closely to what the high masters and masters have to say. The ones who, can and will, impart their knowledge are a valuable asset.
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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Merick on Fri Aug 14, 2015 11:16 pm

Making some notes in a log book can help too, or at least that's what I read.  Making a few notes about when you practiced and what you worked on, how it went, and what you need to work on next time can help keep you focused and productive.  Obviously there is more to record when you are at a match or shooting live ammo (load data, scores, weather) but no reason not to also do it for dry fire too.

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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Regular_Guy on Wed Aug 19, 2015 9:36 pm

dronning wrote:I'm working on reducing my shot process to the following 3 steps:

Pick up gun
Shoot X (or X's for sustained fire)
Put down gun

It's still in development Laughing

- Dave

I think Brian Zins joked about something like that. If only it were that easy!
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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Ed Hall on Wed Aug 19, 2015 9:49 pm

I've always thought you should be able to shoot tens as you do other common things like walking up stairs or drinking from a glass.  But, alas, after more than twenty years, I'm still stumbling about and spilling things...

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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by jmdavis on Thu Aug 20, 2015 4:01 pm

I don't think Zins was joking. He puts the red dot on the X and breaks the shot without the gun moving. That scores a 10 or an X.
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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Jack H on Thu Aug 20, 2015 5:11 pm

Hard holders whose wobble is the size of the X in the X ring have a different situation that most of us will never experience.  I can hold the 10 ring but the shoulder darts out of the hold plus the shoulder drops are frustrating as can be.  Ever since shoulder surgery I have not had the same hold ability.
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Re: Dry Firing The 1911

Post by Al on Fri Aug 21, 2015 11:11 am

Jack H wrote:Hard holders whose wobble is the size of the X in the X ring have a different situation that most of us will never experience.  I can hold the 10 ring but the shoulder darts out of the hold plus the shoulder drops are frustrating as can be.  Ever since shoulder surgery I have not had the same hold ability.

Amen Jack.

I thought I was the only one that was jinxed by the shoulder surgery.  I'd say I got 90-95% back, but occasionally that shoulder drops when I'm moving the trigger.  Sometimes quite a lot.
al

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