Roll or Crisp in 22

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Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by VolScorpion on 5/7/2017, 5:50 pm

How many of you prefer a crisp trigger in your 22 BE gun? I am getting a les baer bullseye soon and i will be putting a roll trigger in it, but i am unsure if i want to get a nelson with the same roll trigger or keep using my volquartsen scorpion. I like the idea of shooting a similar gun each time, but I am undecided before I spend the money on a nelson and a 1911 frame.

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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by Magload on 5/7/2017, 6:01 pm

VolScorpion wrote:How many of you prefer a crisp trigger in your 22 BE gun? I am getting a les baer bullseye soon and i will be putting a roll trigger in it, but i am unsure if i want to get a nelson with the same roll trigger or keep using my volquartsen scorpion. I like the idea of shooting a similar gun each time, but I am undecided before I spend the money on a nelson and a 1911 frame.

You should have been here today by the end of the RF match I might have given my Nelson away and then threw in the LB after the CF match.  I am about to change to revolvers.  Don
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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by VolScorpion on 5/7/2017, 6:15 pm

Well you let me know if you put that nelson up for sale Smile

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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by Magload on 5/7/2017, 6:53 pm

VolScorpion wrote:Well you let me know if you put that nelson up for sale Smile

I learned long ago to never part with a gun or a bow well even fishing rods and reels.  One day will come and I will want them back.  Don
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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by Tim:H11 on 5/7/2017, 7:42 pm

I don't have a roll trigger in my Nelson it's technically a crisp trigger. But it's got a little travel, some say creep, I don't know what to call it, it's got some movement before it breaks. It's very smooth, very clean, almost soft feeling. Nothing to it really. 2.25#. Using an EGW sear, Springfield Mil Spec Hammer, and Colt sear spring. I forget what the disconnector is. Might be a Colt. Might be a springfield. Not sure. 

My Ruger MKIII is a backup 22. It's got a roll feeling to it. I like it. Clean break. I think crisp vs roll depends on how well it's set up. How nice does it feel to the shooter. I've never tried a true "roll trigger". I just do what I can on my own guns the best that I can. Maybe redo it a couple times until it feels right.

Bottom line, I definitely prefer some movement before it breaks. Just a little. Not trigger travel, but noticeable feeling of the sear coming out of engagement with the hammer.
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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by AllAces on 5/7/2017, 7:52 pm

I have a crisp trigger in my M41 and a roll trigger in my 1911 and prefer these set ups. I have a roll trigger in my Ruger MK II and prefer the M41 trigger.
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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by daflorc on 5/7/2017, 9:41 pm

Having an identical shape and feel to the trigger (and grip, ideally) between your guns means you only have to learn one gun. I've got KC roll triggers in my .22 Nelson and my .45 RRA, and though the roll feels different in each gun, they are similar enough to improve my score. I probably picked up an average of 5 points in rimfire by switching from my Ruger Mark III to the Nelson. If its an advantage in centerfire, its an advantage in rimfire.

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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by orpheoet on 5/7/2017, 10:50 pm

My .22s go from a crisp M41 to crisper High Standard M107 to unbelievably crisp Hämmerli 280. I think I might just be a crisp trigger guy.
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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by Froneck on 5/8/2017, 12:52 am

Trigger style is what ever works best for you though I would select one type rather than different types on 2 guns.
 When I started Crisp was the rage, "breaks like glass" was the trigger everyone claimed was best and so that's what I had. One day while eating lunch at a match one of the top shooter was telling others why he changed to a "roll" trigger. As I listened to his reasons I found they were what I was experiencing. I planned on getting mine changed but at the time I was shooting as many matches I could get to so didn't have a chance to change my trigger. At one match my Crisp trigger started to go bad, as the match continued I developed a bit of a "roll" or felt movement before the hammer dropped. At first I didn't like it but as time went on I was beginning to like it since I noticed I was shooting better! Finailly the last rapid fire of the day I had an alibi on the last 5, with 4 away. I shot the last 5 and as walking to the target I and my scorer noticed a large hole in the X ring. I assume kidding the scorer asked "how many shots did you shoot over the top of the target"? The range officer was walking just behind us and said I was watching every one of his shots behind him thru a spotting scope and all 5 alibi shots were in the X!!  My score was 100-7X, I lost 4 X's. From that day on I shot roll trigger! However I have the roll the way I like it and have found over the years shooting "roll" there are quite a few types. When Adam and I were shooting together we talked about a "roll" that picked 3.5 pounds but it felt like 6 yet another style would feel like 2 pounds!
 My style is of course one that feels like 2 pounds but short movement.  Shooting timed or rapid I apply pressure as soon as the target starts to turn, I feel the trigger moving so I do all to keep my sights on the X. I don't have to think about the trigger since it's moving and the hammer will soon fall. As I return to the target after recoil I like to feel the trigger moving. That allows me to ignore thinking about trigger pressure, it's moving and soon the hammer will fall so I concentrate on my sights!

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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by Jack H on 5/8/2017, 2:20 am

In your ideal roll, does it take an even 3.5 (or 2) pounds continuous movement. Or is it a ramp up thing???
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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by Froneck on 5/8/2017, 3:24 am

Naturally the trigger requires 3.5 pounds (45) but it feels like 2. I did like it to ramp up sort of like squeezing a toothpaste tube with the trigger finger but my current trigger feels like a continuous movement. However not a lot of movement because it slows me down in Rapid Fire. I don't like it if in ramps down, makes me feel like my finger is moving too fast, my thoughts goes to the trigger and away from the sight. A friend has what he calls a roll but it feels to me like movement starts at just a little over 3.5 pounds but rapidly decreases with quite a bit of travel before the hammer falls. Almost like crisp with no trigger stop.

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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by Chris Miceli on 5/8/2017, 6:19 am

Froneck wrote:Trigger style is what ever works best for you though I would select one type rather than different types on 2 guns.
 When I started Crisp was the rage, "breaks like glass" was the trigger everyone claimed was best and so that's what I had. One day while eating lunch at a match one of the top shooter was telling others why he changed to a "roll" trigger. As I listened to his reasons I found they were what I was experiencing. I planned on getting mine changed but at the time I was shooting as many matches I could get to so didn't have a chance to change my trigger. At one match my Crisp trigger started to go bad, as the match continued I developed a bit of a "roll" or felt movement before the hammer dropped. At first I didn't like it but as time went on I was beginning to like it since I noticed I was shooting better! Finailly the last rapid fire of the day I had an alibi on the last 5, with 4 away. I shot the last 5 and as walking to the target I and my scorer noticed a large hole in the X ring. I assume kidding the scorer asked "how many shots did you shoot over the top of the target"? The range officer was walking just behind us and said I was watching every one of his shots behind him thru a spotting scope and all 5 alibi shots were in the X!!  My score was 100-7X, I lost 4 X's. From that day on I shot roll trigger! However I have the roll the way I like it and have found over the years shooting "roll" there are quite a few types. When Adam and I were shooting together we talked about a "roll" that picked 3.5 pounds but it felt like 6 yet another style would feel like 2 pounds!
 My style is of course one that feels like 2 pounds but short movement.  Shooting timed or rapid I apply pressure as soon as the target starts to turn, I feel the trigger moving so I do all to keep my sights on the X. I don't have to think about the trigger since it's moving and the hammer will soon fall. As I return to the target after recoil I like to feel the trigger moving. That allows me to ignore thinking about trigger pressure, it's moving and soon the hammer will fall so I concentrate on my sights!

this is a reason i went to a roll. though its on the shorter side. no 10x targets for me..... yet
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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by BE Mike on 5/8/2017, 7:07 am

I vote for C. 2 stage trigger.
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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

Post by LenV on 5/8/2017, 10:45 am

It would be a lives work to set all my triggers so they feel the same. Does it really matter? Don't jerk the trigger. YMMV

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Re: Roll or Crisp in 22

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