Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

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Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by IT1 Wes on 5/26/2018, 2:13 pm

Please help.
I need to make the decision to buy right now or not.

The rail on my Ruger 22/45 MK IV is 3.25 in. long.


What is the minimum distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Ultradot series?
What is the distance between the outside of the ring bases for the Ultradot series given the minimum distance between the inside?


What is the minimum distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot series?

What is the distance between the outside of the ring bases for the Matchdot series given the minimum distance between the inside?


Last edited by IT1 Wes on 5/27/2018, 7:44 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : To correct the title.)
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by 285wannab on 5/26/2018, 2:22 pm

Not sure about the measurements but I have a MkII with an Ultradot on it.  I am 99.99% sure the bases are the same.

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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by bob finger on 5/26/2018, 3:32 pm

I do not have mine in front of me to measure.  I have an MDII on a mkiv 22/45 with the rings on either side of the turrets/controls.  You can also mount both rings in front of the turrets if you want a bit more flexibility.  Won't hurt a thing if that is a better mounting for you. bob

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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by Jack H on 5/26/2018, 3:39 pm

Are you writing about that Ruger base that takes Ruger Rings only?  If so, dump that and get a Weaver type base.
I have 2 brands weaver type that are each 4.75 long
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by IT1 Wes on 5/26/2018, 4:12 pm

I have a Picatinny rail on my Ruger that's 3.25 inches long.

BTW, great article on bullseyepistol.com.


Last edited by IT1 Wes on 5/26/2018, 8:42 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : To correct the length of the rail.)
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by Dcforman on 5/26/2018, 8:08 pm

The middle section of my matchdot is 2.125". So safe minimum distance is probably 2.25". The rings I'm using (I think they're the ones that came with it?) Are 0.595" wide.

Dave

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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by IT1 Wes on 5/26/2018, 8:40 pm

Dcforman wrote:The middle section of my matchdot is 2.125". So safe minimum distance is probably 2.25". The rings I'm using (I think they're the ones that came with it?) Are 0.595" wide.

Dave

So the total distance needed to mount the scope is 3.315" Not within the 3.25" length of my rail. It may work on the Ruger depending on how much the forward ring hangs over the front of the rail. I can still hold on to it for when I get the rails installed on my 1911s.
Thanks for your help.


Last edited by IT1 Wes on 5/26/2018, 8:48 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : To correct the length of the rail.)
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by LenV on 5/26/2018, 9:08 pm

I measured a bunch for you. Hope this helps.

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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by Aufidius on 5/26/2018, 9:22 pm

LenV wrote:I measured a bunch for you. Hope this helps.


+1

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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by IT1 Wes on 5/26/2018, 9:26 pm

Aufidius wrote:
LenV wrote:I measured a bunch for you. Hope this helps.


+1

Thanks for going to all that effort. It helps a lot.
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by JayhawkNavy02 on 5/26/2018, 9:34 pm

Thanks Len!
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by mikemyers on 5/27/2018, 3:47 am

According to the tech support person at Ultradot, you shouldn't put those support rings "anywhere".  She told me the recommended locations, but I don't have my notes with me.

Here's what they have on their web instruction page:
([url=http://www.ultradotusa.com/ultradot manual 2011.pdf]http://www.ultradotusa.com/ultradot%20manual%202011.pdf[/url])

The part I'm referring to is highlighted in bold font, in section #6:


Ultradot – User’s Manual (Ultradot 25, 30mm, FOUR Dot, Matchdot)
Mounting:
YourUltradotisdeliveredwithmountingringsthatfitthediameterofyoursight. TheseringswillattachtoWeaverorPicatinny style scope rails / bases. The hex wrench for these rings is also included in the package.
[list="list-style-type: none;"]
[*]1)  Make sure that the scope base / rail is specified by the manufacturer of your gun and that it provides a uniform horizontal and vertical mounting platform. For your own safety, let a knowledgeable gunsmith inspect your weapon and mounting base to insure that everything is in safe order. Since there in no set eye relief for the Ultradot make sure that you have a minimum clearance of 3” between the sight and your eye.
[*]2)  Use the supplied Allen wrench to remove the cross bolt at the bottom of each ring, and to loosen the top Allen screw sothat you can separate the two halves by approximately 3/8”.
[*]3)  Slide one of the rings onto the base until it aligns with the cross cut groove on the scope base. Insert the cross bolt through the ring base and thread carefully. Loosely tighten so that it stays in place but can still be moved.
[*]4)  Insert your new Ultradot into the ring that you have just mounted and snug up the ring bolts a bit more. Make certain you have the potentiometer knob on the left side for all standard Ultradots and on the top of FOUR Dot Ultradots.
[*]5)  Slide the 2nd ring on the scope base and sight simultaneously. Insert the cross bolt through the mounting ring and cross cut groove on the scope base and loosely tighten. If you have a long distance between the grooves you may have to use the supplied extension tube. To do so, remove the trim ring and put the tube extension in its place. You may attach the trim ring back onto the sight at the end of the extension.
[*]6)  Make sure the sight is mounted horizontally using a level whenever possible. When you are certain the sight is level, carefully tighten the mounting ring bolts making adjustments if necessary. Avoid tightening the rings directly over the sights lenses as you can break the glass if you over-tighten. Also, it’s a good idea to have the rear ring be in direct contact with the center housing of the sight body. This will help to prevent sliding during recoil.
[*]7)  After you have fired a few rounds, check the mounting screws again and re-tighten if necessary.
[/list]
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by IT1 Wes on 5/27/2018, 7:47 am

I am not sure if my rail is long enough.

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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by mikemyers on 5/27/2018, 10:28 am

This might help - I copied the idea from something I saw in this forum.  My reason for doing it was to move the weight of the scope closer to me, as the Model 41 is already quite heavy.  It should be good for a short rail, if the gun is only .22.

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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by LenV on 5/27/2018, 11:54 am

Wes, I would bet a nickel that they work. You might check out different rings. I recently purchased an Aimpoint 7000S and they have a very small rear mounting area. I could have gone like Mike above or a large single but I chose to find a skinnier ring instead. I also have a picture here of a Matchdot II mounted on a 41. The important thing is not the overall width but the space between the slots. This is mine but if you look closely there is over 1/4" they could be closer.


Skinny rings....
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by IT1 Wes on 5/27/2018, 1:02 pm

mikemyers wrote:This might help - I copied the idea from something I saw in this forum.  My reason for doing it was to move the weight of the scope closer to me, as the Model 41 is already quite heavy.  It should be good for a short rail, if the gun is only .22.


Wow, Mike. I slapped my forehead when I saw this. Of course. That is thinking outside the box. Not only is the Ruger 22/45 Mk IV a .22 but also the rail is not on a slide that reciprocates when the pistol is fired. I saw the picture of the Matchdot on the website and was locked into thinking that was the only way to mount it.
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by IT1 Wes on 5/27/2018, 1:27 pm

LenV wrote:Wes, I would bet a nickel that they work. You might check out different rings. I recently purchased an Aimpoint 7000S and they have a very small rear mounting area. I could have gone like Mike above or a large single but I chose to find a skinnier ring instead. I also have a picture here of a Matchdot II mounted on a 41. The important thing is not the overall width but the space between the slots. This is mine but if you look closely there is over 1/4" they could be closer.


Skinny rings....


Thanks, LenV. Thinner rings is a good idea. Also, I found a 4.75" rail at WeiglandCombat.com. My 22/45 has a five-inch barrel, so it would work.

http://www.weigandcombat.com/rm2fd.html

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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by bob finger on 5/27/2018, 1:36 pm

Sometimes a picture is worth ten thousand words.  I said in part earlier "You can also mount both rings in front of the turrets if you want a bit more flexibility." 


From now on I'll wait for the pictures to be posted.  Good luck with your mounting. bob

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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by mikemyers on 5/27/2018, 3:02 pm

One week before I set up the gun like this, I was on the phone talking to this wonderfully helpful person at Ultradot.  I can't remember her name now, but she had sent me some (as yet unpublished) instructions on how to set up the Matchdot II.  She told me she was in the process of re-writing them, and sent me a link to something - maybe the link I just quoted from earlier.

I re-mounted my sight, and started playing around with where to attach it, to avoid all the "moment" adding to the weight of my gun.  Then  something was posted here that made me think of moving the Matchdot II all the way to the rear as shown in my photo.  I don't remember what I saw here that made me think this way, but this concept popped into my mind.  So, I took the sight off and remounted it as shown in the photo.

It accomplished my purpose, felt completely solid, and because of the low recoil, I didn't expect any problems.  At first it looked very strange, but the weight of the gun and sight seemed to be SO much lighter.  

I sent the photo to the person at Ultradot, but haven't heard back from her.  As to thinking "outside the box", my brain always seems to be thinking that way.  I read or watch something, and my mind turns it inside out.  Usually I read or watch it again, and then see it the way it was intended to be seen.  This is good at times, and bad at times.


Plan "C" (which I didn't think of until much later) is to get an Aimpoint.  If I was doing this all over again from the beginning, that's what I would now have on my gun.  It's a single mount, probably using the Kodiak mount, not the one that comes with the Aimpoint, and the sight weighs SO much less than the Matchdot II, in addition to giving me what I feel is a better view.  Aimpoint costs more, but to me it's worth it.  At some point I will replace the Matchdot II with it.
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by Jack H on 5/27/2018, 6:15 pm

This works fine on here and same on my 208s.  Don't recommend for a centerfire.


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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by LenV on 5/28/2018, 12:21 am

Aimpoint took a slightly different approach to cantilevering a scope behind the base. I guess they figured that there had to be some way to mount their "Comp" scope if they were going to build it. Long story short you can buy a A.R.M.S.-17 with Comp II M68 rings and have a mount you could probably drive over. I recently purchased one that came with the 7000S I was actually bidding on. Impressive mount. Very long support base on the bottom and steel narrow ring on top. They are mostly used on AR platforms but I could see them on a heavy/heavier recoil pistol.


Wes, Just an FYI. I was going to mention a different base but I see you found one. My choice was the Volquartsen with their easy case clearance.
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by Magload on 5/31/2018, 1:52 pm

mikemyers wrote:This might help - I copied the idea from something I saw in this forum.  My reason for doing it was to move the weight of the scope closer to me, as the Model 41 is already quite heavy.  It should be good for a short rail, if the gun is only .22.

Man Mike I am glad to see I am not the olny one that has mounted a scope that way.  I was care full to keep it covered up at the range so no one would see it.  Don
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

Post by mikemyers on 5/31/2018, 9:59 pm

Don, I bet it made your gun MUCH easier to hold, right?   Seems to cut the weight in half.  Mathematically, none of that is true, but that's the way it felt to me.  For you too?
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Re: Distance between the inside of the ring bases for the Matchdot I?

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