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.22 Standard Velocity vs High Velocity question

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Slamfire
NukeMMC
bruce martindale
winterneuro
Al
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WesG
Dipnet
JayhawkNavy02
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STEVE SAMELAK
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.22 Standard Velocity vs High Velocity question Empty .22 Standard Velocity vs High Velocity question

Post by StuSegal 6/29/2019, 11:27 am

I'm new to Bullseye, and have been shooting with CCI High Velocity rounds, which seem fine.

One of the other shooters saw my ammo, and advised that I use Standard Velocity instead, so I picked up a couple hundred rounds of CCI Standard, and it works just fine in my pistol.

My question is . . . why is Standard Velocity ammo better for bullseye, and why is it *more* expensive than High Velocity? (I would have thought it would be the other way around.)

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Post by NuJudge 6/29/2019, 1:39 pm

Strange and non-repeatable things happen to airflows just above the speed of sound.  This apparently causes inaccuracy in bullets as they transition downward through the speed of sound.  If you want accurate ammo, amongst other things either stay well above the speed of sound, or start out below it.  High Velocity starts just above the speed of sound.  Standard velocity starts just below the speed of sound.  

One would think that .22 Shorts would cost less than .22 Long Rifle, but that's not the case.  Regarding ammo in general, that which is made in fantastic volume will be cheaper.

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Post by BE Mike 6/30/2019, 6:38 am

If you want to convince yourself about the better accuracy of standard velocity ammo, just test your pistol on a Ransom Rest, comparing your bulk high velocity ammo with standard velocity. Oh yeah, do your testing at 50 yards.
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Post by Kp321 7/1/2019, 10:45 pm

You didn't specify what your 22 pistol is. High Standards and S&W 41's are designed to use only SV ammo and a steady diet of HV can do serious damage. Rugers are OK with HV but will probably shoot more accurately with SV.

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Post by 7tcu 7/4/2019, 6:29 pm

A S&W model 41 can use any 22 ammo. People need to read the book that comes with their guns.
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Post by orpheoet 7/4/2019, 6:39 pm

7tcu wrote:A S&W model 41 can use any 22 ammo. People need to read the book that comes with their guns.

  • Use of hyper-velocity ammunition in this pistol may affect wear characteristics and may result in the need for more frequent ser- vice and/or replacement of parts.
    From the book.

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Post by 7tcu 7/4/2019, 10:29 pm

I have seen that statement before but I am not sure it refers to a 41, I looked at my instruction manual and that statement is not in it.
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Post by LenV 7/5/2019, 12:18 am

Another one of life's lessons. I spent one summer shooting HV thru my 41. I never thought it could hurt it. I've kept the bolt 40 some years now. Just to have a reminder I guess. Or, probably because I never throw anything away.

.22 Standard Velocity vs High Velocity question Dscf1135

Totally ruined. extra space causes fail to fire. But only at the worst times.
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Post by 7tcu 7/5/2019, 3:54 pm

Not trying to start an argument but orpheoet, where is in your 41 manual about HV ammo, mine only says

[list=0]
[*]Use only commercially manufactured ammunition with internal ballistic pressures which are in strict accordance with the specifi- cations of the Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers’ Institute (SAAMI). If you are uncertain, contact your ammunition supplier for verification.
[/list]
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Post by orpheoet 7/5/2019, 4:49 pm

Page 10
AMMUNITION CONTINUED
 • A firearm and ammunition are a system and must work together. There are different types of ammunition for different types of firearms. Your firearm has been designed for ammunition of a spe- cific type and a specific gauge or caliber. It is important to select the proper ammunition for your firearm.
• Use of hyper-velocity ammunition in this pistol may affect wear characteristics and may result in the need for more frequent ser- vice and/or replacement of parts.
WARNING: NEVER USE AMMUNITION OF THE INCOR- RECT GAUGE OR  CALIBER. USING AMMUNITION OF THE INCORRECT GAUGE OR  CALIBER MAY CAUSE
DAMAGE TO YOUR FIREARM AND POSSIBLE SERIOUS INJURY TO YOU AND TO OTHERS.
WARNING: NEVER USE CARTRIDGES OTHER  THAN THOSE  DESIGNATED  BY  THE  MARKING ON  THE FIREARM. DOING SO CAN RESULT IN DANGEROUS-
LY HIGH PRESSURES THAT MAY DAMAGE THE FIREARM AND POSSIBLY CAUSE SERIOUS INJURY TO YOURSELF AND OTHERS.
WARNING: DEATH, SERIOUS INJURY AND PROPERTY DAMAGE CAN RESULT FROM THE USE OF INCORRECT AMMUNITION OR BORE OBSTRUCTIONS. NEVER USE
RELOADED AMMUNITION THAT HAS NOT BEEN SUBJECTED TO INTERNAL  BALLISTIC PRESSURE TESTING. SEE PAGE 9 FOR DETAILS.
• Some brands of ammunition may cause difficulty in extracting spent cartridge cases from the cylinder or chamber. If this situa- tion occurs, thoroughly clean the cylinder charge holes or cham- ber with solvent. If this condition persists, we recommend chang- ing to another brand of ammunition.
WARNING: DISCHARGING FIREARMS IN POORLY VEN- TILATED AREAS, CLEANING FIREARMS, OR HANDLING AMMUNITION MAY RESULT IN EXPOSURE TO LEAD
AND OTHER SUBSTANCES KNOWN TO CAUSE BIRTH DEFECTS, REPRODUCTIVE HARM, AND OTHER SERIOUS PHYSICAL INJURY. HAVE ADEqUATE VENTILATION AT ALL TIMES. WASH HANDS THOROUGHLY AFTER EXPOSURE.
    10
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Post by orpheoet 7/5/2019, 4:52 pm

I’m guessing “hyper velocity” ammo is a relatively recent addition to the .22 choices and maybe not mentioned in older literature. My 41 is a “84”.
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Post by 7tcu 7/5/2019, 7:00 pm

Yea, that is not in my manual. So is "hyper velocity" different from"hi velocity" or is it all the same.
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Post by orpheoet 7/5/2019, 7:20 pm

I’m assuming they are synonymous.
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Post by fc60 7/5/2019, 7:44 pm

Greetings,

If you insist on "going the cheap route", and insist on using High Velocity ammo, buy a heavier recoil spring so the slide does not strike the forward piece of the trigger guard.

I have seen too many well made (expensive) firearms damaged with the use of the wrong ammunition/recoil spring combination.

Some satire....

Then again, with all the money you save buying high velocity ammo, you could just throw the existing pistol away when it starts to malfunction and buy a new one. Sort of supports our disposable society.

Cheers,

Dave
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Post by STEVE SAMELAK 7/5/2019, 7:50 pm

When you compare the cost difference between std  & hi velocity divided by the cost of a high end firearm, what's the point.  In my mind it's like the guy that buys a sports car that complains about the price of fuel & maintenance. scratch
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Post by KB2MBC 7/5/2019, 8:37 pm

I believe “Hyper-Velocity” refers to ammo like CCI Stingers and others of the like.
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Post by JayhawkNavy02 7/5/2019, 10:31 pm

An example from Jerry

.22 Standard Velocity vs High Velocity question IMG-1948-zpspdatdmo6

.22 Standard Velocity vs High Velocity question IMG-1928-zpsow8oo0sn
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Post by Dipnet 7/30/2019, 1:54 am

I have an A-series 7.375-inch model 41 that is more reliable with CCI mini mag (1240 fps) than SV (1070 fps). I have tried the multi spring kit rom Wolff springs and lowering recoil spring weights does not render SV ammo reliable (the issue is cases occasionally getting stuck between ejection area underneath slide overhang that supports sight. This virtually never happens with high velocity 40 gr 1240 fps ammo. Furthermore, CCI ammo is quite accurate at 50 yards (shooting less than 1-in off rest). So, directions, no directions, let the pistol decide. Best, dipnet
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Post by WesG 7/30/2019, 10:39 am

Stingers, and such, are generally considered a no-no for autos. Been that way since they came out, in what, the 70's?

My 41 won't function at all with CCI SV. Or SK from a box. Bulk 'Magazine' was great, apparently not the same stuff. Only other thing I had that worked was some Eley 'Trainer'.

It might have functioned with bulk HV, but I gave all that garbage away.

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Post by mikemyers 7/30/2019, 4:51 pm

WesG wrote:.........My 41 won't function at all with CCI SV. .....
Is that with recently purchased CCI SV, or ammo you've been using for years?
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Post by WesG 7/30/2019, 5:06 pm

Bought in the last year or so. 'Everybody' said it's what to use in a 41, and it's cheap at the LGS (plug for Eddy's). Works fine in every other SA I have.

I'd been using the SK pringles can. And a friend swapped me more for some SV I had a couple years back, as he felt he didn't need the hand lotion treatment you get from fishing them out of the can.
... thoughts of Madge and Palmolive ...

Powder Valley was out of the cans, and frankly I was tired of moving it from the can into my MTM 22 box, so I bought it in a brick of gold boxes. NOT the same ammo. Kinda tough to shoot a decent RF with only 3 holes in the target, WITH an alibi string.

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Post by adminbot1911 7/31/2019, 7:03 am

WesG wrote:I'd been using the SK pringles can. And a friend swapped me more for some SV I had a couple years back,  as he felt he didn't need the hand lotion treatment you get from fishing them out of the can.
... thoughts of Madge and Palmolive ...

I love shooting S*K, it's reliable and accurate in most everything I shoot, but if that isn't the most accurate description of the effect you get when loading magazines with it then I don't know what is.
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Post by Al 7/31/2019, 10:22 am

The SK "pringles can" was some of the best shooting ammo in my Nelson when I Ransom'd it.

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Post by winterneuro 3/4/2024, 8:49 pm

 Furthermore, CCI ammo is quite accurate at 50 yards (shooting less than 1-in off rest). So, directions, no directions, let the pistol decide.

But isn't it about how standard isn't impacted by wind as much as rounds above the speed out sound? I thought that's where a lot of the issue comes in, esp. using high velocity outdoors.

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Post by bruce martindale 3/5/2024, 8:31 am

The hand lotion in a pringles can is the reason that they work so well. Either that or oil them yourself with a stamp pad or fingers. Slide slamming back, or forward from heavy springs is bad. Keep your breechface clean too powder residue is hard

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