CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
+8
Eric D. Adams
adminbot1911
estuck
JIMPGOV
jmdavis
james r chapman
zanemoseley
mhayford45
12 posters
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CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
I learned at Camp Perry the hard way that it is the competitors responsibility to verify their own scores for correctness before the challenge period ends. The NRA Stats department takes no responsibility for correct data entry for your scores per the rules book. This cost me a complete .45 TF match score of 197 12X. The stats department had my proper score sheet but failed to enter it. It was my responsibility to point this out before the challenge period ended and as I was 45 mins late for the challenge cost me the score.
Competitors check your scores for correctness and keep track of the scores separately... photos of the your score cards might be the best way to document your matches. Make sure your preliminary posted scores are correct and know when the challenge period ends!
Competitors check your scores for correctness and keep track of the scores separately... photos of the your score cards might be the best way to document your matches. Make sure your preliminary posted scores are correct and know when the challenge period ends!
mhayford45- Posts : 260
Join date : 2013-02-21
Location : MI
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
So you got docked nearly 200 points for a clerical error. That does suck, hard in fact.
zanemoseley- Posts : 2689
Join date : 2015-07-11
Location : Cookeville, TN
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
Yes, they can’t be bothered with an unusual string of zeroes after inputting and proofing. Even after they KNOW the RO’s are making sure all cards are turned in.
It’s inexcusable!!
It’s inexcusable!!
james r chapman- Admin
- Posts : 6381
Join date : 2012-01-31
Age : 75
Location : HELL, Michigan
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
As a contrast, I met some friends at Andy's after the CMP matches in Saturday and one pointed out that I had a score card in my back pocket. It was my own and was for the 22 EIC match. I went to the CMP office and rang the bell twice. My scorecard was accepted hourso after the match. Within 30 minutes it was entered.
But don't feel too bad the same thing happened to a top long range shooter a couple of years ago at Atterbury. It was eventually resolved. I suggest that you protest immediately.
But don't feel too bad the same thing happened to a top long range shooter a couple of years ago at Atterbury. It was eventually resolved. I suggest that you protest immediately.
jmdavis- Posts : 1409
Join date : 2012-03-23
Location : Virginia
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
GOT ME ON THE .45 SLOW FIRE MATCH. YOU ARE NOT ALONE. JP
JIMPGOV- Posts : 658
Join date : 2011-09-27
james r chapman- Admin
- Posts : 6381
Join date : 2012-01-31
Age : 75
Location : HELL, Michigan
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
What it seems to say is 600 shooters need to camp out around the scoreboards to check their scores to make sure data is entered correctly before the challenge period ends. I was with Mark and we were all checking the scores regularly, including during dinner (when we could get a cell signal). When it appeared they were not being entered we went straight to the stat building, but too late. It is an administrative error that cost him a good score. I understand its the shooters responsibility, but the scores were constantly being updated. How can you tell if you are off site that they are done? I commend Mark, he is calmer about it than I would be.
estuck- Posts : 134
Join date : 2015-01-03
Location : Michigan
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
Where did they announce the posting time for the prelim scores. Again I suggest a protest.
jmdavis- Posts : 1409
Join date : 2012-03-23
Location : Virginia
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
This nearly happened to me this weekend. All of my scores were entered quickly except .22 EIC, which hadn't posted into the following day
Fortunately as a habit I use the FastScanner App to capture every scorecard and most target shot patterns to analyze after I have turned my brain back on.It's better than the camera because it reduces images to .pdf size, 400k instead of 4 megabytes. I can also change from color to black and white, rotate images, and trim them.
I emailed the competitor hotline address and Christina emailed me back almost immediately. The scores were input shortly after.
Fortunately as a habit I use the FastScanner App to capture every scorecard and most target shot patterns to analyze after I have turned my brain back on.It's better than the camera because it reduces images to .pdf size, 400k instead of 4 megabytes. I can also change from color to black and white, rotate images, and trim them.
I emailed the competitor hotline address and Christina emailed me back almost immediately. The scores were input shortly after.
adminbot1911- Posts : 352
Join date : 2019-05-17
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
We spoke to Elizabeth Martin the Pistol Programs Specialists for the Competitive Shooting Division the next morning. The rules are clear and according to her it is the competitors responsibility to know when the challenge period is over.
The rules absolve them from all responsibility. A protest would only be a waste of time. She did respond positively about adding a script to the tower messaging to make sure competitors understand the rules.
The rules absolve them from all responsibility. A protest would only be a waste of time. She did respond positively about adding a script to the tower messaging to make sure competitors understand the rules.
mhayford45- Posts : 260
Join date : 2013-02-21
Location : MI
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
I went with Mark to speak with someone and Elizabeth did have good communication with us. Mark went in with a good attitude and did not go in to argue but to clarify and offer suggestions. Elizabeth did mention an app that may be used in the future.
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
They didn't enter scores for a few of my matches, but I caught it and stood in line the next morning to get them fixed. Checked the boards every evening after the team matches were over.
valbern67- Posts : 278
Join date : 2018-09-04
Location : Norman, OK
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
App or not scorecards can be misplaced/lost on their way to the stat office.Eric D. Adams wrote:Elizabeth did mention an app that may be used in the future.
Best advice is to ALWAYS take a picture of your signed scorecards.
- Dave
dronning- Posts : 2581
Join date : 2013-03-20
Age : 71
Location : Lakeville, MN
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
All good suggestions, but they had a signed scorecard in their possession and failed to enter it. I would suggest a change to the rules allowing for an appeal outside the time limit, for a confirmed administrative error. What is frustrating is Mark never got a direct apology!
estuck- Posts : 134
Join date : 2015-01-03
Location : Michigan
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
A similar error cost me a spot on a World Championship team many years ago. It's one of those things that you have to do or accept the consequences.
It stings, but you'll remember it. That World Championship Team tryout was only 21 years ago...
It stings, but you'll remember it. That World Championship Team tryout was only 21 years ago...
john bickar- Posts : 2282
Join date : 2011-07-09
Age : 100
Location : Menlo Park, CA
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
An app? I find this increasingly the "solution" to the problem of attention to detail, strong internal controls, or good old fashioned leadership. An app isn't going to solve this problem. It might even add to it.
Recommend posted scores in hard copy on a bulletin board in a common location with a time stamp at the bottom. 24 hours after that time, the challenge period ends.
An app... jeez.
Recommend posted scores in hard copy on a bulletin board in a common location with a time stamp at the bottom. 24 hours after that time, the challenge period ends.
An app... jeez.
adminbot1911- Posts : 352
Join date : 2019-05-17
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
24 hrs would be good.
james r chapman- Admin
- Posts : 6381
Join date : 2012-01-31
Age : 75
Location : HELL, Michigan
Re: CP Competitor Responsibility for Scores
I concur with 24 hours or noon the following day. It’s BS when they get posted at 6:30 and challenges end at 8:00.
Wobbley- Admin
- Posts : 4818
Join date : 2015-02-12
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