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Question about centerfire Duello relay?

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Post by sigman45 11/13/2022, 7:54 pm

Are you allowed to rest the pistol on the bench while waiting for the 7 second buzzer or are you suppose to keep the pistol hovering over the bench while waiting for buzzer to go off ? I've been shooting Center fire Bullseye matches for awhile now but really don't know what the official rules are for Duello matches are. I find that the pistol is getting heavy by the last string of fire.

Thank you for reading my post.

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Post by DonBrummer 11/13/2022, 8:04 pm

The gun needs to be at the ready position, meaning as close to 45 degrees as possible without touching the bench.
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Post by Jon Eulette 11/13/2022, 8:14 pm

It has to be 45 degrees or less when you start your lift as target faces. It's frowned upon to rest on the bench, but some ranges have exceptionally high benches and it's almost unavoidable to not touch when lowering the arm/pistol. In the NRA rulebook they would call touching the bench "artificial support"; sections 5.0, 5.1, 5.2 and 5.3.
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Post by sigman45 11/13/2022, 8:31 pm

Thank you all  for answering my questions. I never asked for a rule book when i first started shooting ,so i wasn't sure what was allowed and not allowed. I always kept it at the 45 degree angle but by the 3rd string i start tiring out.
Bernie

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Post by bruce martindale 11/13/2022, 8:35 pm

Try it with a GSP, your arm almost falls off

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Post by RoyDean 11/13/2022, 9:52 pm

Wimps😂🤣😂🤣

I just shot the AZ State International CF this afternoon. That Duelling stage is hard work!

As JE advised, it is all about breathing cadence and lift control. When you get it right it is almost effortless. When you get it right!

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Post by msmith44 11/15/2022, 10:32 am

sigman45 wrote:Are you allowed to rest the pistol on the bench while waiting for the 7 second buzzer or are you suppose to keep the pistol hovering over the bench while waiting for buzzer to go off ? I've been shooting Center fire Bullseye matches for awhile now but really don't know what the official rules are for Duello matches are. I find that the pistol is getting heavy by the last string of fire.

Thank you for reading my post.
Are there rules for Precision Pistol/Bullseye matches? If you are participating in an International Match, see the NRA International Style Pistol Rules, esp. Section 5 Positions and Section 6 Range Standards Equipment for shooting stations. If you are shooting CMP, my recollection is that resting is allowed but... 


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Post by RoyDean 11/15/2022, 10:47 am

AFAIK, there are no CMP rules for International.

The NRA international Rules are online.

The only other rule book would be ISSF, but that is relevant to National level shooters qualifying for and competing Internationally.

AFAIK the NRA rules largely follow ISSF anyhow.

The only CMP event that requires "ready position" is EIC 22.

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Post by msmith44 11/15/2022, 10:53 am

RoyDean wrote:AFAIK, there are no CMP rules for International.

The NRA international Rules are online.

The only other rule book would be ISSF, but that is relevant to National level shooters qualifying for and competing Internationally.

AFAIK the NRA rules largely follow ISSF anyhow.

The only CMP event that requires "ready position" is EIC 22.
45 degree angle and the shooting hand and gun must not contact the bench, see CMP Section 5.1.1(b) even has an illustration.

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Post by Ed Hall 11/16/2022, 9:24 am

NRA Rulebook wrote:5.3c.25 Meter Rapid Fire Events - Rapid Fire Pistol Event,
Sport Pistol and Center Fire Pistol Rapid Fire Stages
and Standard Pistol 20 second and 10 second series.
Shooting must start from the “READY” position. In the
“READY” position, the competitor’s arm must point
downward at an angle of not greater than 45 degrees
from the vertical, but must not be pointed at the ground
within the forward edge of the firing point. The arm
must be stationary in this position
while waiting for the
appearance of the target or, when electronic scoring
targets are used, for the green lights to come on.
Highlight added by me.  You are not allowed to rest on the table and come from there up to fire a shot.  If you do rest your arm, you have to noticeably take the ready position before raising.  If you can fit a short rest into the routine and still meet the requirement for a stationary "ready" stance prior to raising for the shot, you should be OK.  But, if your rest is too long and you raise from there, it's grounds for a warning or disqualification.

The above is my interpretation of the rules.  An official referee may rule differently.

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Post by Jon Eulette 11/16/2022, 9:39 am

Ed’s description is excellent. Really good DUEL shooters have double rest incorporated into the process between shots.
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Post by msmith44 11/16/2022, 3:06 pm

Ed Hall's quote of the pertinent section of the NRA International Rules clarified a bit but the question pertained to resting on the bench. The bench in NRA international isn't the same as an NRA bench. The shooting position in Center Fire Pistol Match and Sport Pistol Match is open to the targets with a small table for loading magazines and resting the pistol between strings. At the load command the shooter loads the magazine and takes the Ready position. Time is given to raise the arm to check on position and the ready position is resumed. At the signal the targets which have been in the edge position turn to face the shooter for three seconds during which the shooter fires one shot and returns to the ready position. After three seconds (=/- 0.1) the targets return to the edge position. This occurs for four more sequences for a total of five shots. Shooters who raise their pistols before the targets turn are penalized and may be disqualified. 

If your'e interested in seeing this in action you might look at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMjpQCQ13d8. This is a ISSF video but you can get an idea of the shooting position, the sequence of action and it does NOT differ from the NRA International Rules. If you are cross dominant watch the Russian shooter. Lot's of Pardini's BTW.

So, in answer to the question in a Duel (or Duello) course of fire there is no bench upon which to rest.

Finally, Duello was the course of fire for the Modern Pentathlon pistol discipline in 1962-64. It has since changed several times since then.


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