Dry Firing a 1911

First topic message reminder :

I really need a lot more dry firing then I been getting and have a question on doing it with a 1911.  I read before on here that the gun needed to be cocked using the slide not just the hammer when testing the trigger because of the disconnect, but does that mater when dry firing?   I also want to try putting something between the hammer face and the firing pin  or maybe if just cocking the hammer then a drywall thing in the chamber.  I know the Nelson conv. is ok to dry fire I was just taught different as a kid.  Don

Your hold wobble I imagine is 75% less with 2 hands vs one

Chris, one month ago one handed was an absolute disaster - I couldn't even hold the gun up long enough, as my hand started shaking so badly.  Now, I'd say the wobble is three to four times worse with only one hand, but at least I can hold the gun up for a reasonably long time, enough to get off one shot.


I was thinking - this thread started out as whether it's safe to dry fire without damaging a 1911. I think we've decided it is.   But from the comments up above, I suspect that I'm going about dry-firing all wrong.  If Cecil is correct (pretty sure he is!!), then maybe someone here could post a step-by-step guide as to what a Bullseye Shooter should do, in way of dry-firing (Cecil??).


I did do a few searches on the internet, but to me, they sound worse than what I'm doing now.  I looked over Tony's blog, which tells me how to imagine a perfect shot, but not what to do with the gun in my room at night if I want to do dry fire practice.


Chris, what you just wrote sounds reasonable, but I've been shooting two-handed since the 1970's.  All I ever cared about was shooting nice targets.

My advise to a new bullseye shooter is start with 1 hand and never go back to 2

Mike,

A good start to a more systematic dry firing practice is found in Ed Hall's series of articles:

http://www.starreloaders.com/edhall/articlesand.html

Ed provides a great and concise approach and his articles are a pleasure to read.

If you want to pursue Bullseye shooting, follow Chris' advice and train and shoot one-handed. You don't have to start with a 1911. In fact, many wise and accomplished shooters recommend spending at least your first year with a .22 pistol to master the fundamentals. You can buy a .22 pistol, which will weigh less than a 1911 and be safe to dry fire. A Ruger 22/45 with its plastic frame and the 1911 grip angle is a great start for both dry and live firing.

On the other hand, if you don't want to invest your time into seriously training for Bullseye and want to simply master shooting a 1911 pistol with two hands, you should continue what you're doing, still read Ed Hall and other high masters and use this forum as a source of guidance applicable to all kinds of precision shooting, not only Bullseye pistol.

Oleg, thanks.  That looks like a goldmine of good information.  First time I've seen it.  

Regarding the gear, I already have everything I need, including the Model 41 I got back in the late 1970's.  

I'm not trying to become a "champion", even if I could, which is highly doubtful.  I am trying to shoot reasonably well, good enough to be at least competitive.  If I work at it, I'm sure I can get decent one-handed.  My goal?  To go home from the range feeling satisfied.

mikemyers wrote:Chris, one month ago one handed was an absolute disaster - I couldn't even hold the gun up long enough, as my hand started shaking so badly.  Now, I'd say the wobble is three to four times worse with only one hand, but at least I can hold the gun up for a reasonably long time, enough to get off one shot.


I was thinking - this thread started out as whether it's safe to dry fire without damaging a 1911. I think we've decided it is.   But from the comments up above, I suspect that I'm going about dry-firing all wrong.  If Cecil is correct (pretty sure he is!!), then maybe someone here could post a step-by-step guide as to what a Bullseye Shooter should do, in way of dry-firing (Cecil??).


I did do a few searches on the internet, but to me, they sound worse than what I'm doing now.  I looked over Tony's blog, which tells me how to imagine a perfect shot, but not what to do with the gun in my room at night if I want to do dry fire practice.


Chris, what you just wrote sounds reasonable, but I've been shooting two-handed since the 1970's.  All I ever cared about was shooting nice targets.

When I dry fire, I execute my entire shot process. This includes visualization, grip, raising the pistol, breath control, sight alignment, and of course trigger execution- everything I do when I shoot, except with the gun unloaded. 
Dry firing is the repetitive execution of ALL the elements required to perform a good shot.

Third tab down, Body Position:

http://www.issf-sports.org/theissf/academy/e_learning/pistol.ashx

Never read, heard or seen one of those guys start in their sport with a two-handed stance and Bullseye is a lot closer to them than it is to IPSC etc. I think?
I sure would like to be able to lock the elbow as well as those guys do.

IMHO 
2 handed shooting and precision shooting are at odds with each other.  I can probably get on target and deliver 5 kill shots faster with 2 hands but when it comes to precision when you use 2 hands your are adding even more muscles, joints etc to the mix.  You might initially shoot fewer flyers BUT when you spend time shooting with 2 hands you are taking time away from building up your endurance and the training time from what you really want, developing precision.

2 handed shooting = fast (.25-.35 splits/between shots) on a 6” x 11” (A zone) target at 10, 15, 20yds
1 handed precision = slow (2 sec/shot in "rapid")  3.36" 10 ring at 50 & 25yds.
- Dave

Buy a Ruger 22/45 lite and put a dot on it. Will be as light as you get and help build muscles while practicing. When you get strong enough sell it to me for half for my daughter to shoot, win/win.

I cock the hammer, pull the trigger back while slowly pulling the slide back to function the disconnector. Let the slide back gently then go through my shot process.  I was instructed by my gunbuilder to NEVER repeatedly rack the slide on a empty chamber. I understood this to mean to not cycle the slide and let it slam back into battery. So I ease the slide back to lock-up.

Wobbley wrote:The reason to cycle the slide is that way the trigger and hammer reset as if the gun was being shot.  

Another reason is that if the thumb slips off the hammer, the hammer is stopped by the safety notch on the hammer and who knows what that does to your sear surfaces.

years ago,  some modified the hammer and sear so the half cock would not affect the pull

the hammer was ground on either side, with a 'finger' in the middle, and the highly honed/polished/etc surface of the sear was notched for that finger,

that way, if the half cock was used (on purpose  or as the safety it was intended to be) it worked as it should, but did not wreck the sear

had a few matched sets , supposedly done by AMU with Gold Cup parts, (and have  no provenance to prove that) years ago
may still have a set squirreled away

BEA wrote:...  Yes, Chris is definitely an anomaly.  We used to be friends until I found out the truth about what kind of powder he uses.  And then there's the time he told me I was lame because I liked a 4MOA dot...and then I accused him of cross firing on my target.  ...

I don't know why he likes that  powder with the funny name.  But he can shoot.