Bought a oddly designed 22lr barrel, need advice.

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Post by Damend on 12/18/2019, 5:31 pm

Hello,
I am in need of some professional advice. I recently purchased an aftermarket barreled receiver for a Ruger MKIV. I thought it would be cool to get in early on a new design from a newer company. At this point I realize that may have been a bit foolish considering my budget and experience level.
Long story short, I have a barrel with a feed ramp that is relieved into the chamber. They did not break the corner of the breechface,  but actually moved the feed ramp into the chamber slightly by design, seemingly to improve feeding.
This small space creates a pocket that allows the casings to swell. It is uniform among all fired rounds regardless of brand so far. This seems pretty crazy to me but the manufacturer maintains that this is part of the design, despite not being advertised as such.
My two questions are:
1 - Is this safe?
2 - If safe enough to use, will this gun be allowed for use in competition?

Any and all insights welcome, thanks in advance.Bought a oddly designed 22lr barrel, need advice.  F5d7bd10
Bought a oddly designed 22lr barrel, need advice.  69f6a310
Bought a oddly designed 22lr barrel, need advice.  8640ac10Bought a oddly designed 22lr barrel, need advice.  F5d7bd10
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Post by dronning on 12/18/2019, 5:44 pm

Personally I wouldn't shoot it.
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Post by SteveT on 12/18/2019, 6:12 pm

If they are reputable they should refund your money. If they are not, they should be sued if/when someone loses a finger or eye. That is probably an exaggeration, but I wouldn't bet my fingers that there isn't enough energy in a 22LR to blow out the case and hurt me.
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Post by Damend on 12/18/2019, 6:23 pm

I appreciate the advice. I’m unsure what my next step is. Apparently there aren’t any refunds. It shoots well so far.
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Post by Jon Eulette on 12/18/2019, 6:38 pm

I have over the years blown out 22 cases when dealing with gun issues on problematic pistols. I knew they potentially could blow out but I was alone and the ejection port was facing away from me. So in a controlled environment I know that they are not that dangerous because of the small powder charge. 
If you shoot that pistol and rupture a case you risk fragments hitting the shooter to your right in the face. When Marvels first came out they bulged cases but not even close to what your pictures are showing. That barrel is unsafe.
You should ask for a full refund. It is poorly designed and they are asking for trouble.
Jon
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Post by Damend on 12/18/2019, 7:13 pm

Jon Eulette wrote:I have over the years blown out 22 cases when dealing with gun issues on problematic pistols. I knew they potentially could blow out but I was alone and the ejection port was facing away from me. So in a controlled environment I know that they are not that dangerous because of the small powder charge. 
If you shoot that pistol and rupture a case you risk fragments hitting the shooter to your right in the face. When Marvels first came out they bulged cases but not even close to what your pictures are showing. That barrel is unsafe.
You should ask for a full refund. It is poorly designed and they are asking for trouble.
Jon

Thanks for that. I know of two other folks with this design and they both had cartridges burst through the extractor slot. They sent them back for repair and they came back worse. No refunds. I feel like I really screwed the pooch on this one. I’ll attach a photo I received today of a returned and “repaired” receiver that belongs to a friend of mineBought a oddly designed 22lr barrel, need advice.  1a3a8710
Bought a oddly designed 22lr barrel, need advice.  F57dc310
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Post by Larry2520 on 12/18/2019, 7:17 pm

Question: are you shooting standard velocity stuff? Maybe I missed that!

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Post by Damend on 12/18/2019, 7:26 pm

Yessir mostly. Shot a box of CCI minimags through it but mainly it’s been CCI SV. In the photos, there is a mix of CCI SV, fed automatch, Norma match, and aguila SE
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Post by Jack H on 12/18/2019, 8:31 pm

I have the same condition with a Sig 220 22 conversion.  All cases bulge down into the unsupported area of the feed ramp.  I sent pictures to Sig. Sig refused to acknowledge any problem.   I am stuck with it. 

Also the conversion is the only gun I have that needed a real break-in with HV before it would shoot SV.  And another was the extractor spring was too strong for complete closing in battery without a push.  I clipper the spring back to fix that. 
It now shoots SV just fine but every case is bulged.  Though not as bad as HV  No more HV in that gun. 

If I did not like the Sig 220 and other P series I got, I would be through with Sig.  The 220 and a 228 are both mid 90s German made.  They are good guns.  More recent Sigs I got, decent but not like the Germans.
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Post by jstanfield103 on 12/18/2019, 9:37 pm

Just curious why they would do that for feeding problems. Mark series do not have feeding issues. I do not think I would shoot that barrel either. Good luck on your quest with it. Hope all ends well for you.
I figure you do not want to mention the company, but a company like that needs to be known about.
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Post by zanemoseley on 12/18/2019, 10:17 pm

Did you pay for the barreled action with a credit card? If so I would seek a chargeback even if it's been several months. It's obviously not safe and your CC company should do the right thing since they company isn't standing behind their product. That's another reason I use CC's for everything I can, the $1k a year in cash back is also nice lol.

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Post by willnewton on 12/19/2019, 5:24 am

I think you need to share that barrel maker name.  It is not about shaming them as much as it is about making sure that the Bullseye community stays safe from potential injury.

There is absolutely zero excuse for what you are having to deal with.

That barrel is not “oddly designed”, it is poorly designed and unsafe.  If you value the well being of the people you shoot with and those who might be affected if you are injured, then remove the barrel and seek a refund via your payment processor if the maker will not give you one.
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Post by JKR on 12/19/2019, 8:25 am

Many years ago I bought a rather high dollar 22 sporter. A lovely rifle in every way except that the extractor cut was a hair too deep and the cases bulged a little. Not nearly as bad as the ones you show. I chose to ignore this little problem and sure enough, a case ruptured and deposited a tiny piece of brass smack in the middle of my right pupil. After getting my eye fixed, I notified the company who reacted immediately and re barreled the rifle. My passion for it had flown and I sold it upon its return.
This was a case of quality control at a very reputable company. However it looks like you have a real hack job on your hands. This is unfortunate. I wouldn’t shoot it of course. I hope you can get some satisfaction from the manufacturer.


Last edited by JKR on 12/19/2019, 12:32 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by spursnguns on 12/19/2019, 11:20 am

jstanfield103 wrote:I figure you do not want to mention the company, but a company like that needs to be known about.

Hello,

MaddMacs Precision Tactical.  I have seen one of these in the flesh....total p.o.s..  They are hacks.

Jim
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Post by Larry2520 on 12/19/2019, 6:51 pm

If it functions and shoots accurately I'd go ahead and shoot it. I really don't see much danger in using it. The worst that could happen is the round has a blow out and since we're only talking about 22 rounds I don't think it would blow the grips off or the mag out or setting the waiting round off. I've had this happen with a 45 round on me. Broke the grips, blackened my hand and made the magazine spring bad.

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Post by radjag on 12/19/2019, 7:00 pm

NCI!

Also not interested in buying one, but was intrigued by the thread. Sounds bloody dangerous to me!

More info is available here:-
http://maddmacsprecisiontactical.com/maddmacs-xbarib.html

MADDMACS XBAR/IB#mptxbarib

Introducing the new MaddMacs XBAR/iB (eXtremely Bad Ass Receiver with integrated Base) for the Ruger® MKIV® Series pistols.  This upper is completely designed and manufactured by Jason of MaddMacs Precision Tactical, LLC in house to fit all MKIV® Series lowers, plastic or steel.  The only receiver on the market with an integrated base, the XBAR/iB eliminates the rear sight dovetail to incorporate a custom MaddMacs base for your FFIII®/Venom®.  The first of its kind to mount a red dot below the top of the receiver giving the shooter an absolute co-witness with the front sight.  Meticulously machined for a perfect fit and a tight lock up on any MKIV® lower.  Available in 3 different barrel lengths and two colors.  No modifications to your Ruger® MK Series bolt or lower are required for installation.  A full list of features, options and specs below:

CNC machined from 6061-T6 aluminum bar stock, 4140 CM steel and 1144 SP steel
Threaded at ½-28TPI with an 11-degree target crown
MaddMacs knurled thread protector included
Match chambered for ultimate accuracy (No CCI Stingers or Quikshok)
Custom MaddMacs integrated base for FFIII®/Venom® installed (RMR® & DeltaPoint Pro® integrated base available)
Dawson Precision Front Sight installed (includes filler screw for removal)
Drilled & tapped for MaddMacs accessory rail (includes filler screws)
Slabbed sides or flutes available
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Comes in a lockable foam lined hard pistol case
3-barrel lengths to choose from:
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         MaddMacs XBAR/iB 5.5 – 5.5” barrel
         MaddMacs XBAR/iB 6.5 – 6.5” barrel

   11. Overall length:
         MaddMacs XBAR/iB 4.5 – 8.43”
         MaddMacs XBAR/iB 5.5 – 9.43”
         MaddMacs XBAR/iB 6.5 – 10.43”

   12.  Approximate weight:
        MaddMacs XBAR/iB 4.5 – 8.4 oz
        MaddMacs XBAR/iB 5.5 – 9.4oz
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More options available after clicking the Buy Now button.  (Barrel length and color are required to complete checkout). Click here to view all available MaddMacs XBAR/iB accessories.

Base price $369.95

Fits the Ruger® MKIV® Series ONLY.  Lower and bolt are required

You can contact me, Jason, at anytime by email at jajones@maddmacsprecisiontactical.com
I will try my best to answer any questions you have as quickly as possible. Thank you for visiting my website. 

MaddMacs Precision Tactical, LLC
2401 Beaverdale Rd NE
Dalton, GA 30721
(706) 463-5323
8am - 6pm EST

Jason Jones / Owner

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Post by zanemoseley on 12/19/2019, 8:30 pm

Larry2520 wrote:If it functions and shoots accurately I'd go ahead and shoot it. I really don't see much danger in using it. The worst that could happen is the round has a blow out and since we're only talking about 22 rounds I don't think it would blow the grips off or the mag out or setting the waiting round off. I've had this happen with a 45 round on me. Broke the grips, blackened my hand and made the magazine spring bad.


Larry,

I guess you missed the part above where a guy had a 22 case rupture and shot a piece of brass into his eye. That's the danger.

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Post by dronning on 12/19/2019, 8:38 pm

zanemoseley wrote:Larry,

I guess you missed the part above where a guy had a 22 case rupture and shot a piece of brass into his eye. That's the danger.
+1, not worth the risk no matter how slight!  13,000psi can create some nice little brass shrapnel.
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Post by Jon Eulette on 12/19/2019, 9:18 pm

I was shooting a match one time and the guy to my left had a case rupture on a 22 cartridge. I had a piece of brassnel cut my cheek. So this pistol is marginally safe on its best day. Just not worth it!
Jon
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Post by PhotoEscape on 12/19/2019, 9:22 pm

radjag wrote:eXtremely Bad Ass

Well, at least guy was honest in naming his product - "bad ass" on each case is indeed.  I'd write it off on R&D.
Looking forward to Len chiming in on this, - he has a great perspective on things like this!

AP
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Post by LenV on 12/19/2019, 11:00 pm

My perspective. Tongue in cheek I would have to say the brass doesn't look any worse then Glock brass. I also note that the bulge is on the bottom so unlikely to blowout right side. Unlikely is not the same as impossible. If I were so inclined to try and save my 400 bucks the first thing I would try is a stronger recoil spring. I have seen bulges like that in blowback 22's when the slide comes back too easy with hotter ammo. A weak spring with SV could do the same thing.

Len
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Post by LenV on 12/19/2019, 11:10 pm

One other thing that should be mentioned. The extractor or extra metal could be holding case away from barrel face. Do a plop test and also inspect to see if it is being held away. I looked at the super blown up pics and bullet should have rim touching all the way around. Not should but could if not being held away by something. An ammo change might even help. I see you have tried some. Not all rims are the same.

Glock brass
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Post by Damend on 12/20/2019, 5:08 am

Thanks for the replies everyone. It is indeed a Maddmacs XBAR. I’m not satisfied at all, unfortunately. I thought I was at first, but after seeing others and learning more, it appears I bought a total POS. I may have to dispute the charge as others have requested. There is a strict no refund policy as of now. But I know a few other unsatisfied individuals with barrels much worse than mine. We are waiting to see someone else’s build that is soon to come, for more info.
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Post by Damend on 12/20/2019, 5:15 am

I know of two others where the cartridge has blown out of the extractor slot. I refuse to sell the upper. I might just cut it up, I’m so frustrated. It also has a loose frame to receiver lock up. I’ve been using a gel insert in the locking block to keep it from wiggling around under recoil.
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Post by troystaten on 12/20/2019, 11:27 am

Wow that is some impressively poor construction and for no reason.

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