What brass do you prefer, and why?

Trying to gain insight here, kinda like what Jerry Keefer frequently shared...

In 45, I had always used WW or RP cases for lead, with minimal resizing to avoid base damage and swaging. These have the thinnest wall thicknesses. 

 I used Federal with jacketed along with standard RCBS resizer dies as they had the thicker walls and better bullet pull is to be had with a smaller case inside diameter. 

I also hear folks use Federal for lead, perhaps with hardcast and bevel base due to case quality?

Thoughts?

Thanks

I prefer free. WW from old navy matches.

most folks will buy new Starline simply because of it's consistent length.. mainly for the LL loads.

I run nothing but 100% Win brass( WCC Match)  for the short line at matches and used mixed for practice. very durable brass.. R-P many times is the longest brass you can find if that interests you,.

Bruce,

Please explain "minimal resizing". 

I've got brass of all makes. When ever I get new brass I have good intentions of keeping it separated but inevitably it gets mixed with the rest. At the level I shoot, I'm not sure it matters.

Jim

Hello Bruce,

I use Starline brass for all my loads, jacketed or lead, and I don't pickup range brass.

Jim

Overall I prefer Federal, but can’t explain why.  I like WW, Winchester and WCC.  I also like R-P.  I have a big tin of TZZ so at one point I’ll be using that up.  The others I keep for training.

I was once asked if I used Starline and my reply was I use Floor. When I first got into this sport and se tup fro reloading I would scarf up any brass I could get. I now sort out some of my brass mostly for consistency. I use Federal and Winchester for match loads indoor and short line outdoors. I load my long line match ammo with Starline. All the rest of what I have is practice/training.

I also keep small primer and certain brass that my loader does not seem to like as throw-away. I lod this stuff up with 230 FMJ for when I shoot in a field or perhaps participate in an action match where the brass mongers pick up everything in sight regardless of whose it might be.

I use star line because it easily slips thru the case gage. Federal hangs on the rim

Try JAG...you will not be disappointed !

https://www.jagemannsportinggroup.com/

Ron

JKR wrote:Bruce,

Please explain "minimal resizing". 

I've got brass of all makes. When ever I get new brass I have good intentions of keeping it separated but inevitably it gets mixed with the rest. At the level I shoot, I'm not sure it matters.

Jim

I do the same, minimal resizing means little to no 'flare' from my expander (hornady ptx .45 colt) and size/decap in a .45 colt die which is oversized. Throughout the loading/firing/reloading process, my brass only opens and closes a few thousandths. It lasts for a very long time. I have been using the same batch of starline for many years and only get a split case once in a blue moon. And the loaded rounds look factory.. perfectly straight brass, no bulged section where the bullet seats. You will get this with the 'flare and squeeze bullet in' method.

+1 for starline, it is pretty cheap new and very consistent. I buy loaded new jhp ammo from zero occasionally (starline brass) and that injects enough new brass into my operation that I never need to buy new brass.

Starline.  Brand new for the long line, used for the short line.

SmokinNJokin wrote:

JKR wrote:Bruce,

Please explain "minimal resizing". 

I've got brass of all makes. When ever I get new brass I have good intentions of keeping it separated but inevitably it gets mixed with the rest. At the level I shoot, I'm not sure it matters.

Jim

I do the same, minimal resizing means little to no 'flare' from my expander (hornady ptx .45 colt) and size/decap in a .45 colt die which is oversized. Throughout the loading/firing/reloading process, my brass only opens and closes a few thousandths. It lasts for a very long time. I have been using the same batch of starline for many years and only get a split case once in a blue moon. And the loaded rounds look factory.. perfectly straight brass, no bulged section where the bullet seats. You will get this with the 'flare and squeeze bullet in' method.

+1 for starline, it is pretty cheap new and very consistent. I buy loaded new jhp ammo from zero occasionally (starline brass) and that injects enough new brass into my operation that I never need to buy new brass.

Thank you for this explanation. I use the Dillon 45ACP sizing die. I do get a large number of split cases. Especially with Starline. I have Colt dies. I'll take a look at them.

Greetings,

Most 45 ACP brass we have access to today is heavy walled compared to the old R-P and Western brass of yesteryear.

A Lee 45 Colt sizing die that measures 0.468" inside diameter will produce brass at 0.470".

Most loaded rounds with 0.452" bullets will measure about 0.472".

Being a Geezer, I have brass from 1960 forward. As a result, I have several sizing dies I use to compensate bullet diameter with case wall thickness.

A lot of work? Yes. It depends if you want consistent ammo so that if a shot wanders out into the eight ring, you know the cause. It is operator error, not the ammo.

Be cautious when selecting a 45 Colt die. Some were machined for the larger 0.456" bullets and if used with 45 ACP, the bullets may just drop into the cases.

History lesson. Star used to offer a 45ACP 2S sizing die. It has two carbide rings. The lower ring just straightens out the fired case. The upper ring sizes the brass about 0.465" to utilize the thin walled R-P and Western cases with 0.451 and 0.452" bullets.

The above dies were also offered in 38 Special. I have one of each.

Now I think of it, Redding now offers such a two-stage die.

Cheers,

Dave

The best die, may be no die at all. However, unresized cases give very low bullet pull force and also lower velocity, to the tune of 50 fps. Jams, maybe. I detest the wasp waisted cases from standard sizer dies  but it eas ok if you had hardcast bevel base bullets. I found that flat base and or softer bullets were alwats damaged in seating. If not seated with a Masaki plug, they tipped and wiped the edge of the base destroying accuracy. I went to Hornady 454.Casul dies years ago as they minimally resize the acp case. Another trick is the Lee factory crimp die but used as a sizer decapper only. These gave excellent results even at long line. It is critical in my opinion for swaged like the zero or old Star hp lead or with light loads that resist sealing the case wall to the chamber (3.3 of BE for example) Right now, l am fooling with neck sized cases and tighter crimps (0.463) as those give higher velocities and clean cases. Sorry for the long wheeze, hope it helps.

I load my 32 with unsized brass. I honestly don't know why I haven't give much thought to this regarding the 45. It may make for some interesting winter testing.

Jim

Like many who are practical, not beholden to a sponsor, nor believers in old gods, I'm a Starline guy. It's consistent, packed properly, and shipped quickly, and goes for the virgin loading on the long line, and then about 7-10 firings on the short. 

Most shooters try to squeeze everything out of what they have, which is horribly short sighted. Brass is a consumable... rifle guys get it, 9mm major guys get it, so why not bullseye shooters?

As tempting as range pick up maybe, I too have moved to either Starline, Winchester or Remington depending on caliber. I segregate by headstamp and mark my cases. I used tio use range pick up but decided the only way to ensure 100 percent reliability was to roll size the brass . I started to think logically about this and suddenly the “free brass” was going to require an $1800 roll-sizer. A few stuck cases and one broken extractor and the light blinked in my brain. YMMV, but where I shoot nearly all the pistol shooters are Using Glocks.( No not to shoot BE) I learned about the Glock bulge the hard way. i now also understand also why the few BE shooters use CMM brass catchers. I also incorporate using a finished round case gauge to make sure everything is to spec. No more surprises and much better results. Live and learn.

I’m using a Hornady  45 Colt sizer and find that R-P is the only one that the bullet (cast) falls thru.

Greetings,

I like Remington.

However, there are two versions of R-P brass.

The old (1960's) R-P 'TargetMaster' measure 0.008" wall thickness.

The current offering measure 0.010+".

Some of the old Federal, Peters, and Western were also thin walled.

Cheers,

Dave

Dave
What’s the advantage of thinner case walls? Case wall consistency would seem to be more important.

I’m beginning to rethink the way I resize my Brass now

Greetings,

Not sure why Remington and Western drew the brass that thin. It would be a more difficult drawing process. Most of the old cases I have measured are quite uniform in thickness. Do recall this is the period when Bullseye was King and competition between the manufactures for the best ammo was keen.

The thin brass is why most die manufactures make such undersize carbide sizing dies. One die has to fit all scenarios.

Fortunately, we loaders have access to tools to measure our components and sort them accordingly.

For those who use range pickup and do not care, continue on with the "standard" sizing dies as they will assure all brass is sized small enough.

Cheers,

Dave

New2BE wrote: I started to think logically about this and suddenly the “free brass”  was going to require an $1800 roll-sizer.  A few stuck cases and one broken extractor and the light blinked in my brain.  ...... I learned about the Glock bulge the hard way.  ....case gauge....

It doesn't have to be that way. +1 on a case gauge though.

I am curious as to your source /cause of a stuck case etc...was that brass not resized, or not sized to the base...thinking...if the die mouth has too large a radius, then the shell base is unresized, and the glock bulge remains. Are they Dillon dies?

Try other dies to reach further down on the case, like the Star does. Lee are good and so are others. If you have room in the toolhead, add a Lee factory crimp die with no guts and put it in a station before the bullet seating operation. The Lee can also be used as a push thru sizer for a one time case base reset. It won't fix cracked brass though.

Few Glockers reload ( and that is a good thing for several reasons). Use of once fired Glock brass should be fine. You will never get rifle type incipient head separation from straightwall postol brass, and a good postol lacks the unsupported chamber. A rifle case that lets go frequently destroys the gun.

I use Starline for many of the same reasons as stated above.  My main reasons for Starline is it is made in my home state of Missouri, the factory is only an hour drive from home, it is readily available and reasonably priced.  Plus I can buy Sierra bullets for hunting which are made next door to Starline brass!!!

Bruce
I used 9 mm Dillon dies in my Super 1050. I’ll pass on Glock fired brass for now. You should check out the output from the 9mm major Glocksters or the +p+9mm WW cases the LEOs shoot. Heck even the Glock 21 bulges cases especially if it’s the plus p stuff. Hard to tell when you have a couple of 5 gallon buckets of thie brass.