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Spinal prosthesis and The Rules

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Post by SingleActionAndrew 8/3/2022, 4:55 pm

I searched and came up dry on this topic

Is anyone aware of any restrictions on prosthetics, fusions, etc of the spine or neck (all internal/under the skin) that could impact a Shooter's eligibility to compete in bullseye type shooting e.g. NRA, CMP, ISSF or the Olympics?

Assuming here the competitor shoots without any external support or other aids
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Post by dannyd93140 8/3/2022, 5:56 pm

Never seen any rules about that and no one would know if the person doesn't tell them.  The only exception may be Olympics.   From what I have read about back surgery don't really think anything like that would help your shooting.
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Post by SingleActionAndrew 8/3/2022, 9:49 pm

dannyd93140 wrote:From what I have read about back surgery don't really think anything like that would help your shooting.
The driver here isn't to install cheater parts. But curious which parts or procedures if any could be seen or treated that way. 

Thanks!
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Post by dannyd93140 8/3/2022, 10:42 pm

SingleActionAndrew wrote:
dannyd93140 wrote:From what I have read about back surgery don't really think anything like that would help your shooting.
The driver here isn't to install cheater parts. But curious which parts or procedures if any could be seen or treated that way. 

Thanks!
I understand what you are saying I was going to back my back fixed, but unfortunately the next call I got after my back MRI was from the Liver doctor.  So not getting my back fixed anytime soon, but I shoot with guy's that have had back surgery and it just makes them act more normal because of the relief from pain.
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Post by Merick 8/3/2022, 11:25 pm

I havent seen anything in the nra or cmp rules.

Issf has a sheet explaining the "therapeutic use exemption " application form. Paraphasing their criteria are basically
-you would be worse off general health without whatever procedure
-would not be better performer with procedures than you would be fully healthy
-there are no better options

I presume the olympics has some similar process. Both are strict about medications.


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Post by SingleActionAndrew 8/4/2022, 9:09 am

Merick wrote:I havent seen anything in the nra or cmp rules.

Issf has a sheet explaining the "therapeutic use exemption " application form. Paraphasing their criteria are basically
-you would be worse off general health without whatever procedure
-would not be better performer with procedures than you would be fully healthy
-there are no better options

I presume the olympics has some similar process. Both are strict about medications.

Thank you Merick!

That 2nd bullet, "-would not be better performer with procedures than you would be fully healthy" is my concern. Could repairing for example the neck with prosthesis, fusion, etc that decrease mobility be seen as a disqualifying advantage over competitors with all original parts.
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Post by Merick 8/5/2022, 12:52 am

SingleActionAndrew wrote:
Merick wrote:I havent seen anything in the nra or cmp rules.

Issf has a sheet explaining the "therapeutic use exemption " application form. Paraphasing their criteria are basically
-you would be worse off general health without whatever procedure
-would not be better performer with procedures than you would be fully healthy
-there are no better options

I presume the olympics has some similar process. Both are strict about medications.

Thank you Merick!

That 2nd bullet, "-would not be better performer with procedures than you would be fully healthy" is my concern. Could repairing for example the neck with prosthesis, fusion, etc that decrease mobility be seen as a disqualifying advantage over competitors with all original parts.
I am 100% certain decreased mobility would be no advantage whatsoever.

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Post by impalanut 8/5/2022, 8:01 am

No matter what procedure you are having on your back, it will only improve the abnormal conditions that you have. It will not make you as good as you were when you were normal, and it certainly won't improve you to better than normal. I can't see how that would be an advantage over someone with no need for back surgery.

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Post by SingleActionAndrew 8/5/2022, 8:28 am

Thanks gentlemen for the feedback. Just trying to understand all (not just shooting) possible implications of different treatment options. Your perspectives help simplify my list of considerations.
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Post by Wobbley 8/5/2022, 11:29 am

My 2 cents:  The Match directors don’t have X-Ray vision or X-Ray machines. So as long as you’re not walking around like “Lurch” of the Munsters no one will know or care.  Since it’s a required medical procedure for your health and well-being it’s NOT “cheating”.  Besides, 90% of the motion is from the shoulder and arm so your performance is only marginally improved if at all.  

So take care of yourself first and last.  Getting old sucks.  If this procedure keeps you shooting even a month longer I will welcome your participation.
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Post by willnewton 8/6/2022, 5:33 am

I shot with a fellow in a wheelchair and no one argued that he had an advantage because he was able to sit down while shooting!
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Post by james r chapman 8/6/2022, 6:54 am

Spinal prosthesis and The Rules E52cc410


Probably not!
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Post by pgg 8/6/2022, 9:24 am

willnewton wrote:I shot with a fellow in a wheelchair and no one argued that he had an advantage because he was able to sit down while shooting!

If he starts winning, someone probably will. Sad

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Post by WRH56 8/6/2022, 12:01 pm

Not directly related to prosthetics (yet) but my $.02 (value of my opinion) based on personal experience and the accommodation process.  I have cerebral palsy and use forearm crutches.  Back around 1991 I got introduced to a local gunsmith who also used crutches (full length).  We felt it would be safer to shoot seated than stand on 1 crutch.  I called the NRA Competitions Division before I went to Perry for the first time in 1993 and submitted pictures, MD note, and explanation.  I received the accommodation (embossed seal and pictures) to carry with me and the NRA kept a copy.  When I arrived at Perry I went to thank them and find out where I was shooting.  They offered to put me on the end of the line to give me more room.  A Range Officer who was standing there stated: "If we put him on the left end he won't have to go down range to score." (Pass to the right, score to the left, no one for me to score).  The only additional responsibility was to repair my target and my position does not disrupt the line.  No one complained any of the years I was there (1993-2003, 2007, 2017) and any match I have shot since then I have asked for and received a spot on the left end of the line.

I have additional mobility and strength issues and that required 2 spinal fusions (low back and neck), and, for awhile, made me shoot weakhanded to be able to raise a pistol without leaning backward.  I have not raised the issue with the NRA and I doubt that I will contact CMP to see if they will accept my accommodations from the NRA.

PS My thanks to all the shooters I have met over the years and to the members of this Forum for the insight and wisdom that they so freely share.
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